Hissatsu: Kaiten

[Jirah]

Nice to see FF14 continued trend of downsizing jobs for literally no reason. SAM didn’t gain any skills in 6.1 this is just a loss pure and simple.

[VictorSpoils]

its pretty funny Kaiten is getting removed before Undraw

Undraw and Summon Eos/Selene will never be modified or removed. Mwahahahaha.

[Kolsykol]

To me the issue isn't complexity, it's fun.
Kaiten is fun...
It feels great to weave and adds speed and variety, the rotations in FFXIV are very static so when you remove skills it inherently makes the rotations more monotonous and less engaging.

I'd rather take a potency nerf that is made up for with Kaiten + the auto-crits ( and lower the level you get Kaiten at ).

[Minarisweet]

Kaiten is not complex. It is exactly the right button to cull from the job because all it does for gameplay is it makes you sit on kenki until you hit 35 so you can always kaiten a iaijutsu. This is not complex, or exciting and it's loss doesn't even really change anything, since you will still want to sit on 10 kenki for movement skills so you're still building to 35. It is the most no-thoughts button in the job.

I don't even really think it looks all that cool since it's an ogcd so it gets clipped constantly. It certainly isn't as cool as the big damage numbers you see from auto-crit midare+analogs. It also makes the hw content not feel like trash since you don't generate enough kenki to kaiten every iaijutsu you use, which is a nice side benefit.

"I'm apathetic to the situation so im gonna interpret what people say whatever way I want just for the sake of having something positive to say and making them look stupid"

[Xenovel]

I will be really disappointed if they remove that skill. The flair and feel of that wind-up before a big hit was a big part of why I enjoy SAM. Others have pointed out there are much better options like Shoha II to consolidate into other skills.

If they're going through with the auto-crits, why not make kaiten guarantee a crit on the next hit?

[Lauront]

I've always liked modifier abilities like that. To the people saying it isn't fun, speak for yourself. Removing it does make it that much less fun to me. If button bloat is such an issue (and we could've predicted easily it would be, didn't take a rocket scientist to figure this one out), enable something like the PVP combos but on an optional basis for players who have the issue. That would involve more work, but it's work that ought to have been done during EW design. With my keyboard and 15 button mouse, it's not even near becoming an issue...

[Hanayumi]

Good, get rid of it! A skill like that loses its touch as a modifier when its not optional to use, aint that big of a deal folks...

[Kolsykol]

I've always liked modifier abilities like that. To the people saying it isn't fun, speak for yourself. Removing it does make it that much less fun to me. If button bloat is such an issue (and we could've predicted easily it would be, didn't take a rocket scientist to figure this one out), enable something like the PVP combos but on an optional basis for players who have the issue. That would involve more work, but it's work that ought to have been done during EW design. With my keyboard and 15 button mouse, it's not even near becoming an issue...

I am getting so tired of the '' button bloat '' issue too.
I don't even have to turn to shift + or anything like that for my single target SAM rotation and if it's really such an issue with AoE too then people can just use the arrows to swap to a different hotbar and use the same keybinds but for AoE.
A lot of the skills too are used infrequently so having some stuff bound to shift + isn't even a big deal...

I really wish people could stop trying to turn FFXIV into WoW or ESO...
The most frustrating part about it too is that most people complaining about this I doubt do any of the content where DPS even matters.
I really wonder how many of the people who complain about button bloat even do the endgame content.

Imo the game is already too easy overall, even if removing Kaiten doesn't make it A LOT easier it still makes it easier and less engaging which only makes the problem with content being easy mode even worse.

Good, get rid of it! A skill like that loses its touch as a modifier when its not optional to use, aint that big of a deal folks...

Why would a modifier be optional <_<?
If it supposedly wasn't such a big deal then why remove it?...

Obviously it is a big deal to a lot of people since it's such a controversial change.
Not a big deal to you ≠ not a big deal to others.

I will be really disappointed if they remove that skill. The flair and feel of that wind-up before a big hit was a big part of why I enjoy SAM. Others have pointed out there are much better options like Shoha II to consolidate into other skills.

If they're going through with the auto-crits, why not make kaiten guarantee a crit on the next hit?

Hey your suggestion is actually really good I didn't think of that.
I hope they listen to the negative feedback and does something like that, it'd actually be a great solution.

[ItsUrBoi]

Making Kaiten guarantee a crit on the next hit is a really good idea if they do so wish to go down the crit route.
However I'd hate to see Kaiten go.
- the animation
- the fact that you have to think ( when you want to use Shinten / Kyuten so that you still have enough for a Kaiten to boost a Iaijutsu, instead of spamming it or saving the resource till raid buffs )
- the fact that it gives some sort of speed to the job

If the problem is button bloat, why not:
- turn Ikishoten when used into Ogi Namikiri and then Kaeshi: Namikiri
- merge Shoha 1 and 2 into just Shoha but AoE with some fall off
- merge Guren and Senei into one, probably Senei but AoE with fall off

[ThivraK]

its pretty funny Kaiten is getting removed before Undraw

don't forget draw and play being seperate buttons