A request for Endwalker Dungeons (No more Undertuned)

[Xaruko_Nexume]

Just leave the forced MSQ dungeons and trial as they are thanks - some people (for many reasons) run these duties only when they have to in order to progress the story and do not do roulettes. Strange as that may be to some there are also many, many people who are not in best of the best gear as they simply have no desire nor interest in running the content that provides that gear. SE have done a great job in not locking out the progression on the story from casuals and providing other content for the non-casuals lets just leave it that way ok?

Yes. I think the current design philosophy does a really great job at catering to most people in the best way possible. Some people can be greedy though and want more and more content for themselves, at risk to the game.

[Leonus]

You're talking in extremes, but I have personally experienced playing with people who just didn't understand how to play their job pretty frequently doing expert roulette. Players that don't AoE for big trash pulls. Bards that mash burst shot all day and never activate a song or apply a DoT.

People only know how to talk in extremes. It's a plague in modern society. Everywhere I turn it seems these forums are just full of complaints.

However the vocal minority get more attention than the silent majority.

Give yourselves handicaps. There are ways to make the game harder without putting it all on the devs who are trying to be inclusive. People can feel how they want but need to keep the game accessible to the majority and not just individuals.

If you aren't having fun, find another game.

[Xaruko_Nexume]

Wildstar shutdown because it released too early and the dev team got gutted right at the start gate, they didn't have the resources anymore to continue adding consistently to the game, people left before they knew about the attunements + difficulty but the game had a dedicated playerbase but the dungeon content was misjudged to be its downfall.

Cataclysm was not hard, it was a syndrome with how long WOTLK last patch took and people knew every fight to heart, Cata release was more of actually this is different and no more on auto pilot.

FF14 earlier dungeons were not hard but defo more challanging what we have now which has fostered a playerbase which skill base has regressed and gotten worse over time.

Sorry but we aren't rewriting history in this thread. I was there. Wildstar died because the perception was that the content was way too hard for a casual player base whether it actually was or not. I also played WoW at the time and literally every time Wildstar was mentioned in game or on the WoW forums it was "yeah that game is too hard." Casuals are the lifeblood of an MMORPG.

Early Cataclysm was a disaster with groups and guilds dying left and right because the queable dungeons were remarkably overtuned. The lead developer, Greg Street, even eventually came out and said making them so hard was a mstake. He says "The hope is that with increased challenge, players will rise to the occasion. We found the opposite to be true." The opposite being, they quit.

[Ryaz]

I'd love to see hard mode dungeons come back. However, there really isn't a reward structure like WoW's Mythic+ where harder dungeons drop better rewards, so they'd probably have to give a bit more incentive for people to play them. Maybe unique glamours, mounts, and other things to farm for. They could add a currency like the ShB fates that you get in the harder dungeons to buy cool rewards with.

[Nemmar]

Wouldn't it be easier to ask for a hard mode difficulty?

[_Pigzig]

How can you even make it easier at this point.

at least you can still actually die. it sounds like a joke but its not.
some companies think grandpa and grandma should be able to play and click the spells and such. it can indeed get worse.

In a lot of games nowadays you hardly die and if you do theres no penalty. Casual WoW is boringly easy as well and maybe theres a reason. Like maybe they tested the audience and found yeah actually this is what most people feel comfortable at.

ive only come back recently and havent played since heavensward. im catching up on all the content and im sad at how boring and quick it is. I can't even enjoy the dungeons and mechanics because it moves too fast. but a lot of real nubs and bads are out there and they can't take criticism if they wipe at all. maybe they can't even handle dying. I still died on Shinryu and probably some other fights ive forgot. they may still find it difficult even like this. Ive noticed the solo dutys or whatever they are called have TWO easier modes now. maybe you and I are the exception.

I mean I don't really know though, im just spewing my thoughts out at the moment.

[Shin96]

I'd love to see hard mode dungeons come back. However, there really isn't a reward structure like WoW's Mythic+ where harder dungeons drop better rewards, so they'd probably have to give a bit more incentive for people to play them. Maybe unique glamours, mounts, and other things to farm for. They could add a currency like the ShB fates that you get in the harder dungeons to buy cool rewards with.

That sounds like a great idea to be honest. They can tie in some rewards for dungeons while adding a currency. Basically they can add a new minion or glamour every new major patch or so. At least it gives you a small incentive to enjoy the content from time to time.

[Shin96]

at least you can still actually die. it sounds like a joke but its not.
some companies think grandpa and grandma should be able to play and click the spells and such. it can indeed get worse.

In a lot of games nowadays you hardly die and if you do theres no penalty. Casual WoW is boringly easy as well and maybe theres a reason. Like maybe they tested the audience and found yeah actually this is what most people feel comfortable at.

ive only come back recently and havent played since heavensward. im catching up on all the content and im sad at how boring and quick it is. I can't even enjoy the dungeons and mechanics because it moves too fast. but a lot of real nubs and bads are out there and they can't take criticism if they wipe at all. maybe they can't even handle dying. I still died on Shinryu and probably some other fights ive forgot. they may still find it difficult even like this. Ive noticed the solo dutys or whatever they are called have TWO easier modes now. maybe you and I are the exception.

I mean I don't really know though, im just spewing my thoughts out at the moment.

I agree man, the game has gotten easier. The only way I imagine they can make it even more easy is to support a vote option "skip enemies" done. At that point it's only walking towards the exit that's the real challenge.

[Alxyzntlct]

I'd love to see hard mode dungeons come back. However, there really isn't a reward structure like WoW's Mythic+ where harder dungeons drop better rewards, so they'd probably have to give a bit more incentive for people to play them. Maybe unique glamours, mounts, and other things to farm for. They could add a currency like the ShB fates that you get in the harder dungeons to buy cool rewards with.

Mythic+ from WoW, while a cool concept initially, has evolved over the years into the single worst game-mode that I've ever seen, fostering one of the most toxic online communities and general mindsets. It's a big part of the reason why I finally left WoW. I dearly, dearly hope nothing of the sort is implemented here in FFXIV.

The critical issues I found with it:
- Focusing around timed runs further emphasized "GOGOGO", which isn't an open-ended form of gameplay a lot of players are interested in, so it begins limiting the amount of playerbase that gets into it
- Originally M+ offered the easiest means of gearing up, which annoyed the raiders so the reward structure started getting really wonky as the years progressed, requiring more work for less rewards, only really rewarding the people who played the game mode hardcore and becoming less and less casual-friendly
- Because of the changes in reward structure, really only rewarding those that push the further, the in-game gatekeeping got INSANE, which killed a lot of casual-access to the game mode, especially if anybody started a season late
- And then recently they started applying mount rewards for completing the major challenge-point, which was clearly an attempt to get more players to attempt it, but wound up resulting in the in-game community gatekeeping access even harder

I understand folks interest in having harder game content to play, but if rewards are involved in any way, shape, or form, then it's going to devolve quickly into unpleasantness for a lot of the playerbase, which so far as I know SE is actively attempting to avoid.

[raelgun]

Sorry but we aren't rewriting history in this thread. I was there. Wildstar died because the perception was that the content was way too hard for a casual player base whether it actually was or not. I also played WoW at the time and literally every time Wildstar was mentioned in game or on the WoW forums it was "yeah that game is too hard." Casuals are the lifeblood of an MMORPG.

Early Cataclysm was a disaster with groups and guilds dying left and right because the queable dungeons were remarkably overtuned. The lead developer, Greg Street, even eventually came out and said making them so hard was a mstake. He says "The hope is that with increased challenge, players will rise to the occasion. We found the opposite to be true." The opposite being, they quit.

I played wildstar from launch, that was a disaster, do you know that the biggest issues with MMOs dying is actually their release states? and that wildstar died the day it launched.

People only heard about the attunements after the fact, so thats false information, thats just the non raiders or people hate being held to a standard crutch to things but it was false, they werent even that hard.

Cata was not hard, it was different as lot of things changed, but not harder. I am aware Greg said that but they cant really say the playerbase is crap, only SE actually does that with a few times saying publically the 'skill gap' and 'Skill disparity'.

Pro tip, get gud.