Stop the WoWificaton (ui mods)

[Awha]

Mods have been a thing in FFXIV long before the influence of WoW creators on our ecosystem.

Though to say a mod is a mod no matter and should all be treated equally is an extremely disingenuous argument. People love to tell me shades of grey exist but why does the samething concept not seem to exist for mods. For some reason the potential harm they may cause is enough to warrent closing the boarders.

[Reap00]

RE: That's besides the point.

Old influencers didn't use mods in respect of SE policies
People used mods moderately in silence like Parsers, Undercutters, etc., the occasional grey zone abusers like Housing

New influencers (incidentally Hardcores that destroyed WoW) come and gain money by A) disrespecting SE B) disrespecting old content creators C) making 'innocent' mods more accessible
More people will share A) the influencer and B) the mods
More people use mods and get familiar with modding
More people now know how to use harmful mods ( Auto-silencer, Bots) and will use them,
actually those are even normalized already (s. Fashionista)
More players, especially PS4, will get excluded ( no-parsers etc)
The marketboard will turn into the same botf est as in WoW
YP will need to answer because he trusted people to be moral about it

Mod advertisers are literally hurting mod users too. And UI is a mod.

Funny how the most unfounded shit gets 2 upvotes for being objectively wrong. Not talking about you. You prob just didn't read my previous post. Anyway.

The man has a good point. There are several people that stream these mods daily on twitch. They also provide links to users on how to add them to their own game. This is against the ToS and they are disrespecting SE and their wishes.

[Awha]

The man has a good point. There are several people that stream these mods daily on twitch. They also provide links to users on how to add them to their own game. This is against the ToS and they are disrespecting SE and their wishes.

Thing is if SE wants their wishes and stance to be taken seriously they should enforce of their standards instead of just hope people do it out of good faith.

[Reap00]

Thing is if SE wants their wishes and stance to be taken seriously they should enforce of their standards instead of just hope people do it out of good faith.

I agree. I suppose we should just start reporting these streamers and let SE handle it.

[EtherRose]

UI mods are against the ToS just like 3rd party programs. Simple, whether you like it or not. Read the ToS.

[Awha]

UI mods are against the ToS just like 3rd party programs. Simple, whether you like it or not. Read the ToS.

Problem is a rule is useless if those in power do not enforce the rule or the punishment does not outweigh the benefits. Risk reward. A ToS that is not enforced is worthless.

[MilkieTea]

I love how Yoshi himself said not to just go around starting report wars over mods like this, and several people in this thread (who use Yoshi P saying ‘yes, technically all 3rd party tools are TOS violations’) just ignore that, while getting upset at people who use 3rd party mods.

[Rae88]

The man has a good point.

They don't. Firstly hardcores didn't destroy WoW, secondly mods don't exclude the PS4 (raiders have been using parsers for years and the console population is healthy), thirdly bots are already rampant on marketboards but part of the reason they are SO dominant in WoW is because gathering and crafting is in a terrible state over there which drives the people out. That's not to mention "moderately" is subjective, I guess if they mean "almost everybody who raids seriously on the PC has ACT" then I guess it is "moderately".

"Undercutters" are apparently a "moderate" use, but I know many crafting friends who are driven nuts by them and have been driven nuts by them for a wehile, but it's fine it's just a "moderate" usage of mods or botting. Not a big deal unlike the "modern, new, WOW abusers with their HORRIBLE DelvUI" making their hotbars look like WoW. That's crossing the line!

[Hoehenflug]

It's cute you just... copy/pasted your post. For the sake of argument, let's dissect some of this.

"Old influencers" have been using mods and addons long before WoW players came into the fold. You're entirely naive to believe otherwise. In fact, it's SE complete lack of enforcement on any of their policies that emboldened the bot crisis. More on that in a bit though.

All these third party programs you've seen were readily available in Stormblood. And some new ones were developed in early Shadowbringers.



Bot programs are used because SE does absolutely nothing about it. They were prominent long before the WoW incursion. Better yet, none of them have been shown publicly by any streamer. What's gained them notoriety is SE's own complete incompetence or willful ignorance when it comes to actually handling bots. Several people have openly acknowledged they bot because, "It's not like SE will ban me lol." Texture mods and Cactbot have nothing to do with Market board bots. SE is entirely to blame for their growth.



This does not happen. And it pretty much never has. It's the boogeyman some casual players point to as an excuse for why they can't do Savage. There are World First players that either play on console or use a controller. Years ago, people insisted ACT would lead to the exclusion of console players yet it never happened. Then triggers was supposedly going to do them in. Still never happened. Texture mods were next and nope. All of these have been around for years yet console players still haven't been excluded. Some minor aesthetic addons/QoL will have the same impact: i.e., none whatsoever.

9 Likes for empty words. This forum is hilarious.

1) Overtly using them, obviously. And earning money from it. You are just nitpicking pragmatics.

2) Look at my posts again. You are beyond missing the point, again. I'm not gonna repeat myself thrice since I'm talking to a wall.

3) etc. does include instances such as undercut bots, flipper bots and auto-silencers et. al. External crap that is already infecting the game. You are cherrypicking the most obvious.

Yawn. You are not worth my time.

They don't. Firstly hardcores didn't destroy WoW, secondly mods don't exclude the PS4 (raiders have been using parsers for years and the console population is healthy), thirdly bots are already rampant on marketboards but part of the reason they are SO dominant in WoW is because gathering and crafting is in a terrible state over there which drives the people out. That's not to mention "moderately" is subjective, I guess if they mean "almost everybody who raids seriously on the PC has ACT" then I guess it is "moderately".

"Undercutters" are apparently a "moderate" use, but I know many crafting friends who are driven nuts by them and have been driven nuts by them for a wehile, but it's fine it's just a "moderate" usage of mods or botting. Not a big deal unlike the "modern, new, WOW abusers with their HORRIBLE DelvUI" making their hotbars look like WoW. That's crossing the line!

First, I'm a gay man, your virtue signaling is honestly weird. I bet you also run around in game with a mask.

Secondly, you bring absolutely nothing new to this discussion. 1) Objectively yes 2)They already, I compiled a list earlier. 3) Pragmatics train again.


RE: It's still funny to me so many people are argueing in favor of addons. The best argument is, 'if it doesn't effect you, why care?'. Cause uhm.. empathy? Concerns? Ever heard of places like Yemen?

Let's see how addons are already influencing FF14:

Auto-silence in PvP
Undercutting
Skip Cutscences
Use of addons 'recommended' in discords
Visual upgrades+ Debuff timers
Meters used in group content to judge people / easily focus MVPs in PvP
Influencers advertising them unregulated
Players feeling cheated out for following the TOS
PS4 players having access to none
etc.

If your friend started FF14 today, would you really recommend the PS4 version with a straight face? How do you explain this to loyal PS4 customers?

I guess some people really miss their WoW ilevel and parser mess. Please go back to the game u ruined.

Again, there's a difference between use and advertising them (for profit). The later should be permabanned imo, but seeing as some of them even got invitations to the media tour, I guess it's time to mod away.

[Rae88]

First, I'm a gay man, your virtue signaling is honestly weird. I bet you also run around in game with a mask.

Secondly, you bring absolutely nothing new to this discussion. 1) Objectively yes 2)They already, I compiled a list earlier. 3) Pragmatics train again.

What are you talking about? The usage of 'they' as a singular, non gendered pronoun was used by Shakespeare and is gaining steam in recent times. It's a perfectly acceptable practice I fully intend to keep going.

1) Objectively you are wrong. 2) Mods have been rampant for years the console base hasn't been excluded. 3) Nothing said by you because you have no argument