"Play XIV if(cont)" and"you have a responsibility to" are not statements that coexist

[EirolOcarrol]

I feel bad for them at this point, I feel like their wasting their money on a game they're obviously not enjoying, but its not my wallet in the end.

I've been playing and enjoying Final Fantasy XIV since 1.0.

I'm not sure how criticizing metagaming or the idea of "casual elitism" means that I don't like Final Fantasy XIV.

[strawberrycake]

I've been playing and enjoying Final Fantasy XIV since 1.0.

I'm not sure how criticizing metagaming or the idea of "casual elitism" means that I don't like Final Fantasy XIV.

ANd as someone who has raided since coils, as someone who knows plenty of people in the ultimate community, I can tell you theres nothing to challenge. The Meta game only applies to when you;re world first progging and trying to clear week one. No raid group I've been in cared for meta, no cares for meta because they're skill carried them far enough, even in the group of people I know currently progging TEA, as their first Ultimate, they dont care for anything *meta* as you say.

If you, or people you know have ran into people like that, I can assure you plenty of people in the raiding community, Ultimate and Savage, think they're mean and toxic as well. And sorry this post does come across as if you've experienced a very toxic time in FF and have had bad experience after bad experience. If thats not the case I can admit I'm wrong. But if you think people are wrong for expecting a lot of the lazier players in this game to pick up their own slack, I think you;re wrong for seeing them as *meta* gamers, they just dont wanna deal with people who arent trying all the time.

[Penthea]

But if you think people are wrong for expecting a lot of the lazier players in this game to pick up their own slack, I think you;re wrong for seeing them as *meta* gamers, they just dont wanna deal with people who arent trying all the time.

You don't need to be a meta player to get irritated when someone is being lazy or is playing significantly poorly. I consider myself to be a very patient player. I give people the benefit of the doubt if I see someone not playing very well. But that doesn't mean it's not annoying when I encounter someone who really is very bad.

[strawberrycake]

You don't need to be a meta player to get irritated when someone is being lazy or is playing significantly poorly. I consider myself to be a very patient player. I give people the benefit of the doubt if I see someone not playing very well. But that doesn't mean it's not annoying when I encounter someone who really is very bad.

I agree, I'm very patient as well and hell, I take being around since the begiining srsly I wanna help when I can, but some people just wear that patience very thin very quickly.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

I agree, I'm very patient as well and hell, I take being around since the begiining srsly I wanna help when I can, but some people just wear that patience very thin very quickly.

I like to call it "infinitely patient, finitely tolerant."

[strawberrycake]

I like to call it "infinitely patient, finitely tolerant."

I like that, and yes it describes exactly how I feel about so much in PF lately.

[Callinon]

You don't need to be a meta player to get irritated when someone is being lazy or is playing significantly poorly. I consider myself to be a very patient player. I give people the benefit of the doubt if I see someone not playing very well. But that doesn't mean it's not annoying when I encounter someone who really is very bad.

Yeah, really often I see the "meta" get blamed when someone is actually just terrible at playing their class.

It's not the "meta" that says a BLM should be using Enochian
It's not the "meta" that says a NIN should be using ninjutsu
It's not the "meta" that says a BRD should sing

It's not the meta pointing out that players playing those classes and not doing those things... are bad at their jobs. That's just basic class mechanics and has nothing to do with the meta.

Here's what the meta IS: "we don't want you in our party because GNB is bad" or "we don't want a SCH healing because AST increases our raid dps by more."

"BLM please cast fire" is not the meta horning in on your playstyle.

[Penthea]

Yeah, really often I see the "meta" get blamed when someone is actually just terrible at playing their class.

It's not the "meta" that says a BLM should be using Enochian
It's not the "meta" that says a NIN should be using ninjutsu
It's not the "meta" that says a BRD should sing

It's not the meta pointing out that players playing those classes and not doing those things... are bad at their jobs. That's just basic class mechanics and has nothing to do with the meta.

Here's what the meta IS: "we don't want you in our party because GNB is bad" or "we don't want a SCH healing because AST increases our raid dps by more."

"BLM please cast fire" is not the meta horning in on your playstyle.

People who complain about those comments coming from elitist meta players don't know what meta comments are actually like.

This is what a meta elitist comment actually looks like: "lol you're playing <class>? It has the lowest dps in the game, reroll instead of making people work harder for your bad choices"

And elitist meta players would say the above even if the person in question is actually playing their class very well.

It is not elitist to expect people to be able to meet the requirements of normal mode content if they have lost their sprout tag a long time ago. It's called normal mode because it's an attainable degree of performance by almost everyone. It is very rare when someone cannot possibly meet the requirements for normal mode.

[linayar]

Really, the fact posting a parse is grounds for GM intervention and not people intentionally holding up a run based on "you don't pay my sub" says all you need to know about which groups toxicity is more of an issue.

Based on that, the answer is obviously the group that needs GM intervention. That's the one that's considered to be an issue.

All semi-joking aside, though...

It is very rare when someone cannot possibly meet the requirements for normal mode.

This is my experience as well, which is why I think both sides are overreacting for the most part.

[LisSquid]

Based on that, the answer is obviously the group that needs GM intervention. That's the one that's considered to be an issue.

Then we are in agreement, then :P

Case still stands that it's absurd to think it is happening enough to warrant the OP opening several threads about it.