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  1. #1
    Player
    Eloah's Avatar
    登録日
    2015/01/29
    Location
    Gridania
    投稿
    2,843
    Character
    Toki Tsuchimi
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    学者 Lv 100
    Quote 引用元:Mhaeric 投稿を閲覧
    Examples like those are what are known as queer coding where it's all subtext and with a good chance to not even be noticed by someone not LGBT. It's a bit of a controversial thing since it's not really proper representation and can very easily slip into the closely related and clearly negative queerbaiting. FFXIV is chock full of queer coding. You can see that just from the examples provided in this thread alone. Thankfully it doesn't yet have any queerbaiting, knock on wood.

    The wikipedia article on queer coding doesn't really delve into the controversial aspect of queer coding much calling it "somewhat of a neutral trope" and pointing out then common 'queer villain' version of it which doesn't really describe the complexity of its historical use and impact particularly by queer creators themselves, but for anyone who wants to delve deeper into it there are some good papers and even some good youtube videos discussing it. Mass media articles on it are kind of surface level and often are actually talking about queerbaiting not queer coding, so I wouldn't bother with those if you want a true understanding of it.
    If you ask me that's the kind of representation you want though. Because, while representation is nice, actively championing a "representative" makes it seem like an exception and not the norm. In cases like the ones I mentioned they are treating it like any other common relationship, not making it a grandiose spectical to appease the masses. I mean there is clearly a distinction between relationships such as Beatin and Gairhard, Sanson and Guydelot, Aymeric and Lucia, and Y'shtola and Runar, compared to ships like Cid and Nero, or Alphinaud and Estinien. If you ask me queer coding is the proper way to show representation. Cause why are all NPCs considered "straight" until proven otherwise. Why can't they be LGBT until proven otherwise?
    (10)
    I like helping people with their Job ideas, it's fun to help them visuallize and create the job they'd like to play most. Plus I make my own too, I'll post them eventually.

  2. #2
    Player Mhaeric's Avatar
    登録日
    2012/04/18
    Location
    Vancouver, BC
    投稿
    2,141
    Character
    Mhaeric Llystrom
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    赤魔道士 Lv 97
    Quote 引用元:Eloah 投稿を閲覧
    If you ask me that's the kind of representation you want though. Because, while representation is nice, actively championing a "representative" makes it seem like an exception and not the norm. In cases like the ones I mentioned they are treating it like any other common relationship, not making it a grandiose spectical to appease the masses. I mean there is clearly a distinction between relationships such as Beatin and Gairhard, Sanson and Guydelot, Aymeric and Lucia, and Y'shtola and Runar, compared to ships like Cid and Nero, or Alphinaud and Estinien. If you ask me queer coding is the proper way to show representation. Cause why are all NPCs considered "straight" until proven otherwise. Why can't they be LGBT until proven otherwise?
    Explicitly mentioning a character's queerness is not a "grandiose spectical [sic] to appease the masses." That statement verges on being homophobic. By contrast, queer coding is what actually exists specifically for the purpose of appeasing the masses; it is used to appease a minority audience while simultaneously not rocking the boat of a majority audience. When "that's the kind of representation you want" is said about queer coding what is really being said is "that's the kind of representation that makes the majority feel more comfortable so you should want it too."

    To answer your question, "Why can't they be LGBT until proven otherwise?" While queer coding like that is not inherently negative on its own, when it is the only thing being offered and deviating from it is termed a grandiose spectacle then it is a problem.

    These videos are very film-centric discussions of queer coding both its negative and positive aspects, but the ideas apply to all fictional media and are both generally pretty good analyses of it.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsO4...ellgren-Fozard
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=riKV...nel=RowanEllis
    (3)
    2020/09/06 10:21; Mhaeric が最後に編集

  3. #3
    Player
    Driavna's Avatar
    登録日
    2013/09/27
    投稿
    1,459
    Character
    Elara Almasombria
    World
    Sagittarius
    Main Class
    暗黒騎士 Lv 90
    One thing: FFXIV is a game from Japan and there a public demonstration of affection is not the norm, that's something you do in private. This rule applies to every sexual preference.
    (7)
    2020/09/06 16:52; Driavna が最後に編集

  4. #4
    Player KayRadley's Avatar
    登録日
    2015/01/14
    投稿
    434
    Character
    Kay Radley
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    モンク Lv 90
    Quote 引用元:Driavna 投稿を閲覧
    One thing: FFXIV is a game from Japan and there a public demonstration of affection is not the norm, that's something you do in private. This rule applies to every sexual preference.
    There's also the fact that, when it comes to rights for and treatment of LGBT+ people, Japan is, in many ways, worse than the West. Gay couples cannot adopt, lesbians cannot undergo in-vitro fertilization, and sexual orientation and noncis gender identities are not legally protected. No amount of yaoi or yuri manga and anime can hide the fact that Japan has a lot of catching up to do when it comes to this matter.
    (4)

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