I'm gonna say something unpopular: I don't like to rush.

[Alleluia]

You made this standard.

Others disagree.

Not exactly rocket science.

Still waiting on any actual reasons btw. I could jump off the edge of every normal raid I do for the first five minutes - whatever, still gonna clear, doesn't matter. The logic is clearly flawed.

I'm confused. I made what standard? Please clarify.

Are you conflating executing AOE combos with pulling more than one pack of mobs? Cus you can AOE down single packs before moving on to a new one. So you can be perfectly fine using an AOE combo and still only want to pull single packs. I do this when running trusts, for example.

[Veis_Alveare]

I'm confused. I made what standard? Please clarify.

Are you conflating executing AOE combos with pulling more than one pack of mobs? Cus you can AOE down single packs before moving on to a new one. So you can be perfectly fine using an AOE combo and still only want to pull single packs. I do this when running trusts, for example.

The standard you created was "as long as the dungeon gets cleared it doesn't matter" and that is most definitely not a standard that applies to everyone. It very much matters to lots of people that a dungeon is completed quickly.

You can of course use AoE on 3 enemies but using it on 15 is five times as effective. People care about that too. CDs (both defensive and offensive) line up well with big trash packs. I don't want to never have any reason to burst, it takes boring content and makes it even more boring.

I just wish people would stop staring their opinions as facts. You guys dont make the rules of duty Finder. If you can convince the other party members to kick the competent player who doesn't want to take forever go ahead but otherwise better to sit back and let people do their damn jobs.

[linayar]

Except the context is different. They're pulling to speed up the run and have no intention of causing a wipe whereas you refusing to pull off them is entirely out of pettiness while knowing full well said pettiness can lead to a wipe.

Even if you subscribe to the belief pulling for the tank is rude. Allowing the party to potential wipe so you can "teach them a lesson" is far worse.

I've never said to allow the party to wipe, so I don't know what you're talking about here. It seems like you're trying to respond to other people's posts, not mine.

a single-pulling tank in an endgame roulette is widely considered a detriment to the party; They're playing in a way that is considered obstructive/slow by most players doing endgame roulettes

A slower run is not obstructive in any way, and it's not a detriment to clearing a dungeon. So your premise is false.

Still waiting on any actual reasons btw. I could jump off the edge of every normal raid I do for the first five minutes - whatever, still gonna clear, doesn't matter. The logic is clearly flawed.

Yeah, your logic is flawed. Taking yourself out of the fight and letting others complete the work for you is not the same as doing smaller pulls in a dungeon where everyone is still doing their part in the fight.

[Veis_Alveare]

Yeah, your logic is flawed. Taking yourself out of the fight and letting others complete the work for you is not the same as doing smaller pulls in a dungeon where everyone is still doing their part in the fight.

It'd literally be less impactful to the success of the run to not participate in a normal raid than it is to pull small. Less time would be wasted. Pulling small is just basically AFKing anyways - tank doesn't need CDs and the healer can either tunnel vision dps or curebot.

Your part of the fight as anyone in a dungeon is to facilitate the expedient completion of the instance, same as any other group content. Baby pulling is literally not doing your job.

[Penthea]

Your part of the fight as anyone in a dungeon is to facilitate the expedient completion of the instance, same as any other group content. Baby pulling is literally not doing your job.

Eh I'm on the fence about this. There are a lot of reasons why a tank may not want to do big pulls. But I'm an easy going person so as long as things aren't too difficult or annoying I'm happy. But I understand why some want bigger pulls because it is faster and more interesting, and certainly for me who plays a healer single pack pulls are most times incredibly boring. I just don't happen to care much if we take things at a slower pace. When I'm in the mood to go super fast I bring my buddies with me to ensure I get the exact experience that I want.

Single pack pulls aren't wrong. They're just a more laid back playstyle. That's it really. Nothing special.

[LittleImp]

A slower run is not obstructive in any way, and it's not a detriment to clearing a dungeon. So your premise is false.

lol.
Modern MMOs favor efficiency, and rewards gained are usually compared to the time spent to obtain them. Rewards are looked at in terms of Xp/HR or Tomes/HR. Time has direct value in terms of rewards / character progression. Expectations around this are still fairly tempered, but no one wants to spend 2 hours doing daily grind content when they could spend 1 or less and use the rest doing other things like crafting or raiding.

If someone is left with only a few hours to play because of work, I think they'd rather not spend all of it held hostage in their dailies exclusively because someone has decided it's acceptable to put 0 effort into playing a cooperative game.

[Penthea]

lol.
Modern MMOs favor efficiency, and rewards gained are usually compared to the time spent to obtain them. Rewards are looked at in terms of Xp/HR or Tomes/HR. Time has direct value in terms of rewards / character progression. Expectations around this are still fairly tempered, but no one wants to spend 2 hours doing daily grind content when they could spend 1 or less and use the rest doing other things like crafting or raiding.

If someone is left with only a few hours to play because of work, I think they'd rather not spend all of it held hostage in their dailies exclusively because someone has decided it's acceptable to put 0 effort into playing a cooperative game.

Not saying I disagree with not wanting to spend very long doing things that are normally a lot shorter, but I can't say that my experience with single pack tanks has ever been that whatever combination of content I wanted to do that would normally take about an hour would end up taking two hours instead. You would need distinctly awful dps in addition to a single pack tank for content to take such an incredibly long time to complete. Which would also mean that the dungeons would take very long anyway even if the tank pulled multiple packs because the dps would be too crap to take advantage of the amount of mobs.

[phantomr23]

Not saying I disagree with not wanting to spend very long doing things that are normally a lot shorter, but I can't say that my experience with single pack tanks has ever been that whatever combination of content I wanted to do that would normally take about an hour would end up taking two hours instead. You would need distinctly awful dps in addition to a single pack tank for content to take such an incredibly long time to complete. Which would also mean that the dungeons would take very long anyway even if the tank pulled multiple packs because the dps would be too crap to take advantage of the amount of mobs.

It's an additive sort of thing. If every single-pulling tank adds five minutes onto your run, consider just how many dungeons you run over the course of your playtime in FFXIV. It's not like individual runs will be utterly awful - though I have had some trainwreck runs in the 40-60 minute range, but it's definitely something that eats your time up.

[Penthea]

It's an additive sort of thing. If every single-pulling tank adds five minutes onto your run, consider just how many dungeons you run over the course of your playtime in FFXIV. It's not like individual runs will be utterly awful - though I have had some trainwreck runs in the 40-60 minute range, but it's definitely something that eats your time up.

Yea sure it does but saying that something that normally takes an hour takes two hours instead just because of a tank pulling single packs? Based on my personal experience it would take far more than just a single pull tank to increase completion time by such a huge amount, even across many instances. Personally all my crazy long dungeons have been due to things that lead to wipes, people dcing or going afk. Never solely because a tank pulled one pack at a time.

[tdb]

It's an additive sort of thing. If every single-pulling tank adds five minutes onto your run, consider just how many dungeons you run over the course of your playtime in FFXIV. It's not like individual runs will be utterly awful - though I have had some trainwreck runs in the 40-60 minute range, but it's definitely something that eats your time up.

And then consider how much time you've spent browsing imgur, or watching netflix, or something equally unproductive. I'd wager that will trump the time taken for slower-than-average dungeon runs in FFXIV.