Summoner is doing too much in 5.10

[remiff]

They'll probably reduce Tri-disaster potency to (something around) 250 and return R4 and DoT potencies to what they were before. Even Egi Assaults may get a potency reduction, though I prefer they leave those as they are now since a lot of people were asking for Egi Assaults to be stronger and we got it now.

No is too much ,
dont abuse,
is not op at this point .
Summoner does not need a big nerf .

[remiff]

Yes but 2.5 gcd on egi assault and 2.5 gcd on r4 = cancer
they will nerf the rez or devotion .

the summoner shines again that people want to demolish it again

the summoner community never complained when the black mage was op during a entire raid tier.

[Grimoire-M]

Yes but 2.5 gcd on egi assault and 2.5 gcd on r4 = cancer
they will nerf the rez or devotion .

the summoner shines again that people want to demolish it again

the summoner community never complained when the black mage was op during a entire raid tier.

SMN mechanically is fine. Reverting Ruin IV’s buff and taking a bit from Tri-Disaster is fair. I’d prefer to keep the DoT and pet potency as is.

[Trunks]

After a few days of log updated we get more data

Really curious what data you're looking at, because SMN is beating BLM on every fight in Eden right now? Even for top parses it's ahead on 3/4 of them. It's only getting more obvious that SMN was egregiously over-buffed. The post-patch change is way out of line with the other Jobs that got adjusted upwards - RDM, MCH, DNC, and SAM. SMN's gains are 60-70% higher than RDM, which has seen the second-biggest increase in output. E1S? SMN is up 12%; the pre-patch gap with BLM was only 2%. E2S? SMN is up 12%; the pre-patch gap with BLM was 10%. E3S? SMN is up 11%; the pre-patch gap with BLM was 7%. E4S? SMN is up 11%; the pre-patch gap with BLM was 9%.

This is one of the biggest buffs that I can ever remember in a non-expansion patch, and it's all the more curious because SMN was not even the worst off. Combined with its ridiculous mobility and the noticeable slowing of its frenetic playstyle, I'm not even sure why SMN should be beating RDM. (And incidentally, RDM is exactly where it ought to be: 2-4% behind BLM.)

[ForteNightshade]

After a few days of log updated we get more data, i find smn is actually okay, they still lose from a BLM in a fight that dont need move much and even in a fight where people need to mive much they still lose to a max potential BLM (Hades top is back to BLM whoops! Yes)

If anything need fixing its not damage output, but rather mobility... SMN is so mobile compared to BLM(which if you ask me is actually mobile enough but need planning which most player cant cassually be done) which make their damage near equal... and dont forget RDM the poor guys need a buff much in all department except raise

How can you classify a job with vastly better utility doing equal to superior damage okay? Summoner brings more to the table than Black Mage and is inherently less risky. Even without Resurrection, its still the better Caster. With it? There's no question. The bigger issue, however, is how Summoner compares against Red Mage. Both have a battle raise yet one leaves the other in its dust.

Simply put, Summoner either does everything better or its few shortcomings aren't enough of a hindrance to slow it down.

[Kabooa]

How can you classify a job with vastly better utility doing equal to superior damage okay? Summoner brings more to the table than Black Mage and is inherently less risky. Even without Resurrection, its still the better Caster. With it? There's no question. The bigger issue, however, is how Summoner compares against Red Mage. Both have a battle raise yet one leaves the other in its dust.

Simply put, Summoner either does everything better or its few shortcomings aren't enough of a hindrance to slow it down.

I mean sure, but get rid of the Raise and it's mostly fine.

I'll bang this drum as much as I can. It's always been about the raise. The moment it gets taken out of the picture, it doesn't really matter if Black Mage isn't the top damage dealer. The crown's nice, sure, but that crown has changed heads so many times you really shouldn't look inside it. What matters is that they aren't obsolete, and that's what raise does.

It is a binary "Is/Isn't" obsolete switch. It needs to go, or it needs to be heavily adjusted and shared, or it needs something that provides enough of the same boon.

[Shiroe]

Smn might get nerfed, ..., but when looking at more data, Smn 5.1 is not as OP as 4.1 was back than (damage-wise), when in 4.x Smn got a nerf for being too OP in 4.1

imo Smn shouldnt get a nerf, instead Blm should get a slight buff (if SE wants to keep up these heavy movement fights in the future)

Smn is in a good dps spot overall, when looking at its numbers now, it shouldnt be nerfed (or only barely)

just Smn dps is overall too strong overall compared to Blm (and Smn are almost too mobile too for that damage output too)

TLTR:

Smn seems great, but for its (new) great mobility, its too strong compared to Blm..

leave Smn as it is (dps and mobility), instead buff Blm slightly

[Shiroe]

.... or nerf Smn single target damage a bit, but buff back its aoe damage again..., while adding more (stacked) add phased in savage raids and Ex trials..

giving back Smns old identity of (good ST dps, but great aoe dps)
...
but truthfully Smn atm doesnt really need a change / nerf..

(Blm might need w slight buff though, .. especially if the next savage tier or ultimate keeps turning up the notch on movement)

[Nemekh]

the summoner community never complained when the black mage was op during a entire raid tier.

You must be remembering a different community altogether. Many smns and rdms complained in game, on social media, in discord servers. Many smns and rdms who switched to blm for the tier complained because it was that much better in damage (and feel of execution in the case of smn).

The job may be shining right now, but the brilliance is too much that it's going to blind people due to their own subjective definitions as to what counts as a balanced state for PvE DPS as a whole. Again while comparing the other casters vs BLM is important, that's not what the big picture is about right now. Especially with The Epic of Alexander (Ultimate) looming around the corner.

[Miminming]

Really curious what data you're looking at, because SMN is beating BLM on every fight in Eden right now? Even for top parses it's ahead on 3/4 of them. It's only getting more obvious that SMN was egregiously over-buffed. The post-patch change is way out of line with the other Jobs that got adjusted upwards - RDM, MCH, DNC, and SAM. SMN's gains are 60-70% higher than RDM, which has seen the second-biggest increase in output. E1S? SMN is up 12%; the pre-patch gap with BLM was only 2%. E2S? SMN is up 12%; the pre-patch gap with BLM was 10%. E3S? SMN is up 11%; the pre-patch gap with BLM was 7%. E4S? SMN is up 11%; the pre-patch gap with BLM was 9%.

If you only looking at the last 2 week or 5.1 patch the yes SMN is the top on all data, but BLM didnt get any change in 5.1 so you should take 5.0 into account because the good blm havent even upload their log this patch.

Even in e4s which need loots of moving,
5.0 BLM max percentile is 16k(winning from SMN)
5.1 BLM max percentile is 15,6k(losing from SMN)

And not just max actually all range of show some different if you compare 5.0 BLM and 5.1 SMN, BLM still win in 90+ percentile.

So yeah dont just look at 5.1 ITS A TRAP! the top blm member not even arrived!