Astro changes 5.1

[Brandedblade]

Even after everyone's input you still don't seem to get it. We're not asking for it to give us TP cards again, if you were thinking that then god help you. We're asking for the card variety buffs back, it's more fun and appealing for everyone. Yes I will get Angry when they take away the fun out of my class, just because you didn't like it doesn't mean everyone else won't. This has nothing to do with Astro's other abilities, we're asking for them to give back what made Astro feel special. Just because you like something so dumbed down and basic to the core doesn't mean it's the "Right" way it should be. I will continue to voice my opinion about how I feel they destroyed the fun out of my Favorite and main class that I've spent so much time into and there's nothing you can do about it. Square Enix will realize it sooner or later.

And I will continue to express my opinion that the varied cards where not as great as you remember them.

I can somewhat sympathize with the notion of wanting things like DH,Crit and/or Haste cards. But things like MP restoration and damage mitigation should NOT be tied to rng, as those elements are things that need to be on demand to get the most out of. Relying on randomness for such make or break mechanics is bad, no matter how good getting that Bole for the tank who was getting destroyed by a large pull felt. Relying on luck for those type of situations is bad.

However, if you put variety into the card effects, it may increase group synergy in certain situations, but all that will happen is people, you know, the ones you said ruined the job, will just math out the Best Card and it will revert back to being expected to fish for the best card and only settle for the worse cards when your rng runs dry. Which is how it was played a the highest skill level then, and how it still plays.

[CrimsonGunner]

I can still argue that's what AST is still doing...

if that is your argument,i will try to explain to your argument is wrong on those regards:

1.Cards meanings- AST using his card is the same as fortunetellers doing tarots.every card has a different meaning because it represented a different aspect in life(love,fortune,endings,happiness...)the old cards had different effects because just like tarot cards are based on the constellation in FF14 which each represent different aspect. the new cards are basically the same card meaning all the different aspects are pretty much ignored so image you go fortune reading to know about your career or love life and the fortune teller tells you she cant cause all the cards just mean 1 thing, nothing.

2.divination mechanic- u claim u set them up to an end goal but it isn't really that cause:

1.you don't set up anything,it comes for just playing the card. you can choose to play it or redraw for a new one which is more akin to a gambler who don't like what he drew so he ask the dealer to give him a new card instead. which unlike the old system as people said you actually get to interpret the card use if you use it as it is or RR for the next draw or MA and turn it to lady/lord which had different effects and lastly redraw.

2. reverse slot machine-i believe someone said it before me but divination mechanic works more like a reverse slot machine,instead of getting 3 identical marks to hit "jackpot" you need 3 different one which again gambler themed not someone who is reading fate.you are basically playing a manual slot machine,"setting up" seals from cards that you still would have to play them with "hitting the jackpot" is as rewarding as not hitting it "fits" AST theme perfectly.you can try and claim MA help you set up cause it won't use seals but it just shows it became a gambler cheat when he isn't happy with the card he given so he rigs the results,same as redraw is right now.(basically AST is a gambler who rigs his slot machine)

3.getting a weaker version of the good utility all the time from a kit aspect that should represent fate and how random life is contradicts AST theme.
not to mentions there are other buffs that can also increase damage then just a pure and really low damage increase(DH,CH,Skill/Spell speed...).

4. having the niche utility you had get baked on other classes kits basically means your class being gutted ,it is a simple fact.

5.the focus is on the cards themes,while it good they made healing skills that rely on predicting the future in the healing kit that doesn't mean the cards theme was changed. their theme still remains the same in the lore, AST use them to read the future and help ishgard in defending and predicting the enemy movement.
as i explained before if all the cards were basically identical, fortune telling would have been useless in ishgard and AST would probably wouldn't even be considered a job there.

[CrimsonGunner]

And I will continue to express my opinion that the varied cards where not as great as you remember them.

I can somewhat sympathize with the notion of wanting things like DH,Crit and/or Haste cards. But things like MP restoration and damage mitigation should NOT be tied to rng, as those elements are things that need to be on demand to get the most out of. Relying on randomness for such make or break mechanics is bad, no matter how good getting that Bole for the tank who was getting destroyed by a large pull felt. Relying on luck for those type of situations is bad.

However, if you put variety into the card effects, it may increase group synergy in certain situations, but all that will happen is people, you know, the ones you said ruined the job, will just math out the Best Card and it will revert back to being expected to fish for the best card and only settle for the worse cards when your rng runs dry. Which is how it was played a the highest skill level then, and how it still plays.

the point is having varied buffs ,having MP restoration and damage mitigation can be tied to rng as long it also tied in different part of the kit for on-demand situations as you said.

the fact you still playing fishing for cards doesn't mean its a good thing,in fact it what made those changes to ast in the first place.
and even if people will still try to do that,SE could have found a much better implemented solution to reduce fishing.
hack even with the new system it could have been implemented better to make each card have equal value without making them have the same buff.

in the end ,if you hate rng so much then again go be a scholar or white mage,the point that people love ast is the varied buffs and its ties to rng.

[Boomsmash]

And I will continue to express my opinion that the varied cards where not as great as you remember them.

I can somewhat sympathize with the notion of wanting things like DH,Crit and/or Haste cards. But things like MP restoration and damage mitigation should NOT be tied to rng, as those elements are things that need to be on demand to get the most out of. Relying on randomness for such make or break mechanics is bad, no matter how good getting that Bole for the tank who was getting destroyed by a large pull felt. Relying on luck for those type of situations is bad.

However, if you put variety into the card effects, it may increase group synergy in certain situations, but all that will happen is people, you know, the ones you said ruined the job, will just math out the Best Card and it will revert back to being expected to fish for the best card and only settle for the worse cards when your rng runs dry. Which is how it was played a the highest skill level then, and how it still plays.

Agree on MP refill. Make it an effect of the Divination / Whatever AoE, done. Now back to the real shambles, which we've covered on other threads before.

The Spread and such we had before let us save a card for later if we figured we'd need it. Once set up it was there, and it wasn't luck because it'd come up and be tucked away if we figured we'd need it. Divination? Rename it Shared Fate, make it an AoE effect cooldown, done. We have Minor Arcana as a ST effect booster button already.

"Best Card" <- This is a bad argument against having the other cards too and you should feel bad.

[Brandedblade]

the point is having varied buffs ,having MP restoration and damage mitigation can be tied to rng as long it also tied in different part of the kit for on-demand situations as you said.

the fact you still playing fishing for cards doesn't mean its a good thing,in fact it what made those changes to ast in the first place.
and even if people will still try to do that,SE could have found a much better implemented solution to reduce fishing.
hack even with the new system it could have been implemented better to make each card have equal value without making them have the same buff.

in the end ,if you hate rng so much then again go be a scholar or white mage,the point that people love ast is the varied buffs and its ties to rng.

Nah I'm good, AST is actually fun now. It's nice and busy with the new cards. Timing the cards with burst windows and setting up Divination and Sleeve draw windows is a far more engaging loop then fire and forgetting Chain Stratagem every 2 mins or simply spamming Glare until you need to heal something.

[Brandedblade]

Agree on MP refill. Make it an effect of the Divination / Whatever AoE, done. Now back to the real shambles, which we've covered on other threads before.

The Spread and such we had before let us save a card for later if we figured we'd need it. Once set up it was there, and it wasn't luck because it'd come up and be tucked away if we figured we'd need it. Divination? Rename it Shared Fate, make it an AoE effect cooldown, done. We have Minor Arcana as a ST effect booster button already.

"Best Card" <- This is a bad argument against having the other cards too and you should feel bad.

Like it or not there was always a "Best" card. Damage is the most important metric in optimized play so whatever card gave the most damage is seen by many to be the "Best" card.

[Boomsmash]

Like it or not there was always a "Best" card. Damage is the most important metric in optimized play so whatever card gave the most damage is seen by many to be the "Best" card.

Everything you said makes it self evident what is wrong with your argument.

There was always a "best" card. There will always be a "best" card. But only if you are a worshipper at the optimal > all altar. That is the sum total of your lack of understanding of our objection.

We don't give a flying fuck about optimized play. We want engaging play, we want enjoyable play, we want variety to not be bored out of our minds. Most play is NOT optimal. It is improvisation, it is using what works best at that particular instant and that is *gasp* NOT ALWAYS MORE DAMAGE.

Optimal. Does. Not. Matter. Non-janky does.

[Haxaan]

One of the most fun parts about the "less optimal" playstyle of 4.X AST was the fact that it was a gamble. In the world of XIV 95% of all content is scripted, with there being a set path to go, a set group of monsters, a set pattern of attacks from bosses and mechanics. Yes RNG Bole or Ewer were not optimal, but you played the hands you were dealt and when you got the right card for any given situation it felt so god damn rewarding. When you got a bust it felt bad, but so does losing a hand of poker. The highs were high and the lows were low, but it was engaging and fun and never the same thing twice. The randomness gave it charm and the variety gave it flavor.

It feels like I had cable with all the international channels, some were great, some were trash, but it was interesting to see what they all had to show me. Now all I have is local news stations that all tell different versions of the same story all day long. It's predictable and safe and boring.

There seems to be a divide in the AST fan base. Those who value numbers and optimization above all else and don't care about gameplay or enjoyment, and those who enjoy playing the job because it is fun and interesting and offers something different from the other cookie cutter jobs that are straight forward and don't think outside the box.

[Verlyn]

I got my potency buffs so I am happy for the time being (That is, this is about what I expected out of 5.1). I wish they'd done more to address AST's MP regen but that is about it.
When it is realistic to, however, they really ought to look at the cards.

[MitsukiKimura]

And I will continue to express my opinion that the varied cards where not as great as you remember them.

I can somewhat sympathize with the notion of wanting things like DH,Crit and/or Haste cards. But things like MP restoration and damage mitigation should NOT be tied to rng, as those elements are things that need to be on demand to get the most out of. Relying on randomness for such make or break mechanics is bad, no matter how good getting that Bole for the tank who was getting destroyed by a large pull felt. Relying on luck for those type of situations is bad.

However, if you put variety into the card effects, it may increase group synergy in certain situations, but all that will happen is people, you know, the ones you said ruined the job, will just math out the Best Card and it will revert back to being expected to fish for the best card and only settle for the worse cards when your rng runs dry. Which is how it was played a the highest skill level then, and how it still plays.

I honestly prefer the old cards to the new cards any day any time and this is coming from a player that has been playing AST since Stormblood came out. Just reading your posts obviously suggests you enjoy less engaging gameplay that is stale, boring and lame which most other people such as myself find not fun. Please Stick to SCH because I do not want your stale opinions having an effect on my class. Honestly get out of here.