SE: Please copyright takedown FFLogs.

[Oscura]

it is

that's why yoshida doesnt want that in the game

Yoshida doesn't want it in game because they can't fake plausible deniability when something happens with ACT, parsing or FFlogs.

If something happens, they can simply shrug and say "it IS against the rules, so we will ban this person, but it is also not our fault."

If they endorse it or make it themselves, and something happens, then they are both responsible and it is also much harder to ban or punish players properly.

Yoshida does not care about your feelings, nor does Square Enix. They tolerate and even have advertised streamers and raiders who regularly parse.

[galbsadi]

Yoshida has said that he’s aware players like to parse, track their numbers, and use the site. As long as people don’t talk about in-game or harass players with it, they won’t do anything to them. He watched world first progression groups for both Ultimates that had parsers clearly visible on their streams.

As it should be. Used properly, a parse is a valuable tool to find out where you can do better. I say this having looked at logs of my own performance in every game I've ever raided in specifically to see either (a) where my group could improve or (b) where I myself could improve.

Granted, FFXIV makes it a bit easier than other games, but that doesn't mean that it can't help.

[Alaray]

Parsing's fine.

It's a useful tool to utilize to improve. It's a necessary tool to help diagnose problem areas in groups (re: Statics). Report people who harass you with it, since SE will take action.

If you're upset people can see you're not a good player, who cares. Don't party with people who don't want you, and who you don't want.

It's not private information, SE owns the account you're renting. Which means the character data is SE's data. If you're still scared about your numbers being posted to a third party website for something as trivial as a videogame, go and hide it. Or just stop doing content people parse in.

Yoshida is fine with it, a tool providing direct information to the player that can then be critiqued is healthy. No one can get better if everyone's blindfolded.

[LiteBrite]

Parsing's fine.

It's a useful tool to utilize to improve. It's a necessary tool to help diagnose problem areas in groups (re: Statics). Report people who harass you with it, since SE will take action.

If you're upset people can see you're not a good player, who cares. Don't party with people who don't want you, and who you don't want.

It's not private information, SE owns the account you're renting. Which means the character data is SE's data. If you're still scared about your numbers being posted to a third party website for something as trivial as a videogame, go and hide it. Or just stop doing content people parse in.

Yoshida is fine with it, a tool providing direct information to the player that can then be critiqued is healthy. No one can get better if everyone's blindfolded.

Guess certain people here speak for Yoshida.

[IzzyData]

The hypocrisy and the double standards in this thread, is quite amazing.

Tends to happen when people debate with feelings rather than evidence. It feels like talking to a child.

[Keddera_StormMoon]

Okay.... I'm gonna have to step in on this "this is my private information" issue. As somebody who makes a living in the IT Support End of the Legal Field, I am trained on this regularly and have to be mindful of it anytime I come in contact with such information during my troubleshooting.

Private information is anything that is personally identifiable. This includes things like your B-Day, your SSN or passport number, your medical history, ect.

YOUR PARSER LOGS ARE NOT PERSONALLY IDENTIFIABLE INFORMATION AND ARE NOT SUBJECT TO THESE LAWS.

At the most, they point you to your character which can be found on the Lodestone webpage anyway, but it doesn't trace back to you as a person.

I'm sorry, as much as some of you hate to hear that and would love to use it to make your argument, the law as I've been trained on the issue does not back you up in this case.

[IzzyData]

Okay.... I'm gonna have to step in on this "this is my private information" issue. As somebody who makes a living in the IT Support End of the Legal Field, I am trained on this regularly and have to be mindful of it anytime I come in contact with such information during my troubleshooting.

Private information is anything that is personally identifiable. This includes things like your B-Day, your SSN or passport number, your medical history, ect.

YOUR PARSER LOGS ARE NOT PERSONALLY IDENTIFIABLE INFORMATION AND ARE NOT SUBJECT TO THESE LAWS.

At the most, they point you to your character which can be found on the Lodestone webpage anyway, but it doesn't trace back to you as a person.

I'm sorry, as much as some of you hate to hear that and would love to use it to make your argument, the law as I've been trained on the issue does not back you up in this case.

As an IT security professional I'm going to have to disagree with you on that. Of course it is near negligible, but still wrong.

[Kaitoo]

I know it's not my data. That's not the point. The point is that per the licsense agreement that I signed there Will be No usage of third party programs. Now a third party program is gathering and condensing data related to my character for anyone to see.

It honestly doesnt matter what data it's gathering. It's a third party, gathering data in a game that who's tos States that there Will be No third party involved!

This is actually a breach of contract if taken directly.

Nobody would have cared if they'd just kept to themselves. God knows I didn't. Now since people are parading this around it's become a topic of discussion.

Add to the fact that you have to manually take steps to opt out of a program that isnt Even supposed to be there AND is against tos.

i dont think you know what gathering data means in this context. The combat log is avaible to everyone in your group/instance. I can see that and note it down, with pen and paper, manually, and put it where i want if i feel funny. That doesnt have anything to do with a licence agreement.
Its like saying i cant talk about your character and whats its wearing cause its data gathering

[Skogli]

I dont get it. People are dismissing valid arguments here like third parties being against ToS, information being gathered without notification, shaming based on third party data, personal information concerns and the like. All while claiming No valid argument has been made!

I mean sure you keep saying "parsing is a valuable tool when used correctly" but the fact of the matter is that it IS being used with ill intent, it IS against ToS and it IS forcing you to participate.

SO we're basically saying "we like parsers and you dont have to use them, but we're gonna collect your logs either way because it's OK! The third party software says it's not collecting chatlogs. Even if it does, you signed the ToS so you dont get to complain about anything Even though the ToS says that the parsers that collected the stuff without notification is against Said ToS!"

Makes sense where? We're being forced into the third party program we're agreeing not to be a part of by default. It Even set's up a profil for us which other can browse at their leisure. The point isnt what it's used for but that it's there in the first place and so intrusive.

If you sat down and started tracking someone else's numbers manually, compiling them in your notebook and published it, it would take a lot of work and too much time to be considered anything other than really inappropriate. Unless it was spesifically requested. Thats stalker level dedication just to get information on a person's preformance and pretty unreasonable.

It's the same thing as a parser. I know because i just took the exact same argument that was used to dismiss my concerns several times. "someone could technically start a blog and write out your numbers and it would be the exact same thing."

Why?

Is it because you can't play without it that you're so blind to the point that's being made? Is it that you just don't care Even though the whole thing is shady? What about bots? Would you be ok with people using scripts as Long as they didn't tell? Buying gil and leveling?

Or is it out of spite..? The feeling of having some sort of power over your peers?

Change the ToS or enforce it. This is ridiculous..

[Keddera_StormMoon]

As an IT security professional I'm going to have to disagree with you on that. Of course it is near negligible, but still wrong.

Okay, now you're just trolling.

Anybody who comes in contact with this type of information on a regular basis and is held liable for it if leaks knows better. And you clearly don't.