What's disappointed me most about RDM in 5.0

[Katie_Kitty]

I'm extremely disappointed with 5.0 Red Mage as well. All these other classes get thoughtful things or cool things that demonstrate a passion and interest for the class, but RDM was just tossed in the garbage alongside WHM. They aren't even pretending to care about whether or not red mage is a good class. The additions they made, for the most part, appear to have taken a grand total of 5 seconds to think up and don't really help in any substantive way for endgame content. I'm happy about getting stronger AoE but everything else about this sucks. In this whole expansion we only have 1 good new skill to look forward to and even that pales in comparison to what almost every other class got.

[Seraphor]

I dont really get what's going on with Verthunder. When does it become AoE?

[Aethaeryn]

Something Like a damage down [something defensive Id say or an aggro cut so it doesnt *compete* for DPS] on displacement with 200 potency and just leaving Engagement with 200 potency no additional effect would have been an okay compromise. :C

With the Engagement thing, it's worth noting that you do lose at least couple of autoattacks if you Displacement and Corps-a-corps or run back in after the next dualcast spell. I'm not sure how much potency RDM autos have (or if that potency is changing at all with 5.0 changes), but that might be part of why Engagement is lower potency than Displacement. RDM autos are pretty weak, so 50p weaker might be too much, but we don't know if these are the final numbers that will appear at launch either. But if they were both 200p, you'd basically never want to use Displacement from a straight up min/max standpoint unless you could time the cooldown for a specific mechanic. A lot of RDMs don't hang out close to the boss for autoattacks anyway, so I guess it's a moot point then.

[Katie_Kitty]

I dont really get what's going on with Verthunder. When does it become AoE?

There are two skills both named verthunder and two both named veraero. One verthunder and veraero is AoE, the other is not. Impact is now always an AoE spell that upgrades from scatter. I have no idea why they did it this way and it seems incredibly lazy/half-assed. It makes me mad what they're doing to a class I love.

[Seraphor]

There are two skills both named verthunder and two both named veraero. One verthunder and veraero is AoE, the other is not. Impact is now always an AoE spell that upgrades from scatter. I have no idea why they did it this way and it seems incredibly lazy/half-assed. It makes me mad what they're doing to a class I love.

I can't see the new Verthunder anywhere on his hotbar. Are you sure its not an upgrade?

[Rongway]

I can't see the new Verthunder anywhere on his hotbar. Are you sure its not an upgrade?

Rightmost action in the AoE section

[Seraphor]

That's just... odd

[Nalien]

With the Engagement thing, it's worth noting that you do lose at least couple of autoattacks if you Displacement and Corps-a-corps or run back in after the next dualcast spell.

Well, numbers are changing with 5.0 anyway, but right now;

Break deals 50 potency, and I'm hitting a Lv1 dummy for around 1600.
Autoattacks are hitting for about 70.

So that's about 23 autoattacks to make up for the 50 potency difference? Probably doing this wrong, I just quickly checked on a dummy outside my house.

I can't be asked to work out how that would fit into the recast of Displacement/Engagement, but it does raise an interesting point. If the idea really is that the potency difference is down to autoattacks... Why not go all in on that? Give Engagement a buff or debuff that enhances your autoattacks for a short duration. That at least makes the ability conceptually interesting. You could even give it raid utility... Imagine if Engagement applied a debuff that increased the amount of damage from autoattacks a target takes... It's not Trick Attack levels of impactful, but at least it would be something...

I guess you'd always be using it instead of Displacement then though, but given it's designed already to be used instead of Displacement based on level design.... IDK, the whole skill is a mess IMHO. They need to go back to the drawing board with it... Of all the skills shown for 5.0, Engagement gives me the most "Shake it Off" vibes.

[JohnSpawnVFX]

Manafication resets leap timers.

Edit: Nevermind. Got Embolden animation mixed up with Manafication. Sorry.

[Burningskull]

I've always thought RDM was one of the jobs that was just perfect from the ground up. Only thing I wanted from ShB for them were white and black AoE mana builders. Which we got I'm not sure why they felt the need to make a 2nd backstep ability instead of just decreasing how far back the current backstep ability sends you but meh. Also not sure when or why you would want to use the ranged ability that costs 10 mana unless you accidentally get over 50/50 and don't want to double to make it 100/100 for the mana double ability. I think RDM looks fine but I also don't need over complexity to have fun.