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  1. #31
    Player
    The_Distinguished_Anarchist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    27
    Character
    Guilford Fairclough
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Theodric View Post
    No, it wasn't. It's a beloved title that is still actively supported in the present day - whereas many MMO's that came after it crashed and burned. If it wasn't for FFXI's success, FFXIV would likely never have been made - and it very likely would not have been remade after 1.0 proved to be a disaster.
    It was a niche title that never achieved any sort of significant recognition beyond the distinction of being the most widely-played Japanese MMO in the world.

    The success it enjoyed was entirely due to the Final Fantasy IP, and having the (at the time) commercial juggernaut of SquareSoft be able to continuously throw money away to support it. It was well over a year after the game's initial release before it attracted enough subscribers to break even.
    If that game had been released by any other company you would not even know it ever existed.
    (12)

  2. #32
    Player
    Bacent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Kweh
    Posts
    1,834
    Character
    Bacent Rekkes
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Liam_Harper View Post
    Blue is simply a Carnival class.

    It has no practical application outside of the Carnival. It's designed so that you get carried through levelling, get carried through dungeons, get carried through EX primals and then you're done. There is no reason at all to form Blu groups for content when you get no extra rewards, can't rez, have inferior dps, inferior tanking ability and one healing ability. It's not designed for playing outside the carnival.
    Fun is practical. Fun with friends is a reason to form Blu groups to run content again and again. It just doesn't meet your definition of fun I'm guessing. Hell, myself, my husband, and a few friends in the FC had fun the other week, all on alt characters that were Roegadyn, and we just spent hours spamming emotes, taking weird pictures, recreating memes in game and just laughing our asses off from all of it.

    Fun is what you make of it, and if you don't make something out to be fun, then just don't play it. It's simple.
    (5)
    Please show support for chocobo boots to be added -> http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/323512-Suggestion-for-an-item-to-be-added-to-gold-saucer-Chocobo-Boots

    Unhappy with how they implemented Mahjong? -> http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/381358-Mahjong-is-the-most-depressing-mini-game-you-ve-added-to-XIV

  3. #33
    Player
    Fawkes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    2,731
    Character
    Fawkes Macleod
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Distinguished_Anarchist View Post
    It was a niche title that never achieved any sort of significant recognition beyond the distinction of being the most widely-played Japanese MMO in the world.


    Quote Originally Posted by The_Distinguished_Anarchist View Post
    The success it enjoyed was entirely due to the _________ IP, and having the (at the time) commercial juggernaut of ________ be able to continuously throw money away to support it.
    So like pretty much every game ever, then?

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Distinguished_Anarchist View Post
    It was well over a year after the game's initial release before it attracted enough subscribers to break even.
    It launched in Japan only and came out in North America a year later.

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Distinguished_Anarchist View Post
    If that game had been released by any other company you would not even know it ever existed.
    Yes I agree, if it was a different game entirely it would have been much worse.
    (9)

  4. #34
    Player Theodric's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    10,051
    Character
    Matthieu Desrosiers
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Reaper Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Distinguished_Anarchist View Post
    It was a niche title that never achieved any sort of significant recognition beyond the distinction of being the most widely-played Japanese MMO in the world.

    The success it enjoyed was entirely due to the Final Fantasy IP, and having the (at the time) commercial juggernaut of SquareSoft be able to continuously throw money away to support it. It was well over a year after the game's initial release before it attracted enough subscribers to break even.
    If that game had been released by any other company you would not even know it ever existed.
    You're overly cynical. FFXI launched in a completely different era and at a time where MMO's were known to be tougher on average than they are in the present day. It's also not a bad thing for an MMO to rise to prominence in large part through brand recognition alone since...that is exactly the case with the most successful MMO's to exist in the present day. Namely WoW, ESO and GW2.
    (11)

  5. #35
    Player
    WellFooled's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    1,313
    Character
    Doranaux Wavemet
    World
    Goblin
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by KokonoeAiyoko View Post
    One of my issues with this game was that the jobs being locked into only three roles made for very repetitive gameplay if you play this game for an extended period and it would also be a detriment to a job when it finally got in because limiting these jobs to these specific roles and balance of said roles would undermine the abilities they had in the past games and traits that made them unique and fun in the first place.

    I would love to see this idea fleshed out even more so, maybe even have stuff like an alternative Summoner down the road, Puppetmaster, Beastmaster, Dancer, etc.

    All in all... Thank you, SE for listening to us FFXI players. It is much appreciated.
    It would be awesome to have support jobs or hybrid jobs like past games in the franchise, but if you can’t actually use it for anything worthwhile than the quality of being support/hybrid/customization is worthless. BLU is cool, super cool, but the way it’s been implemented makes it worthless.

    Once you have a level 50 BLU with all of its abilities and can customize to your hearts content, there are no worthwhile endevours to use them on. The duty finder restrictions blocks it from most worthwhile content and the level cap blocks it from the rest. A level 50 BLU no matter how skilled, learned, or geared won’t be as effective as a level 70 of anything else. This even applies to BLU focused pursuits like learning the primal abilities. What is more easily done: a group of 8 BLU get together and take on a primal to learn abilities or a BLU or group of BLU just party with a single level 70 to take those primal out faster and more efficiently? BLU isn’t even equipped to do its own activities better than a level 70.

    Not that I think it has anything to do with how BLU was implemented, but as a FFXI player of four years during its hayday I’ll say, “No thank you, SE.”
    (3)
    A true paladin... will sheathe his sword.

  6. #36
    Player
    AnimaAnimus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    1,344
    Character
    Cynric Zerr
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 70
    ppl are still on this "ffxiv isn't xi /rage" train?

    So they add a lil ffxi spice into the mix, big whoop, it was a good game if you were dedicated and skilled enough for it. Plus, I don't see anyone complaining about all the WoW they added...

    That being said, I think ffxi and ffxiv blu are two very different things and are less similar than blus from other titles. You had much more versatility and use of blu in xi, esp with various sub jobs, spell combos and gear sets. Also even with hundreds of spells, they were much much less of a pain to learn than xiv's have been, outside the overworld ones that is. blu in xi was a juggernaut that you could use for practically anything while blu in xiv is really just a fancy mini game with little to no reward or long lasting appeal atm.
    (3)

  7. #37
    Player Dualgunner's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    2,942
    Character
    Lilila Lila
    World
    Coeurl
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Daniolaut View Post
    .... You must be, I'm sorry. He didnt bring it up. I did... just like you said....
    You learn to live with it.

    You're absolutely right, the raiders do cause a bit of grief. Not only to SE but to me yes. Quote from Yoshida himself "The raid is too hard, make it easier. The raid is too easy make it harder, Its difficult to find the balance." Not exact quote but there abouts.
    Again, surprising how you can pin all this grief on less than five percent of the players, figure quoted from you. As far as Yoshida? I'm sure he does care about what raiders think when talking about the content specifically designed for them. And he's been quite happy with the compromises made recently; watering savage down and introducing Ultimate.

    They grief me because they wont let jobs be jobs/different. Not only boosting BLM's dps to one of the highest dps classes in raiding, but now BLU is limited. Let me show you this thread of mine! http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t... the same bar.
    Yeah, the entirety of the <5% of the gaming population specifically is griefing you because an AOE focused job is practically useless in the game as it's designed now. Also I disagree with your premise, even back in 2014 when that was posted, SMN was always the AOE mage in my eyes.

    I apologize as well that many people feel the identity of the destruction mage should be the highest dps output of the mage subrole.

    I agree some jobs shouldnt outshine all jobs in one category, but I also dont think they should all be the same. Example is first coil. BLM would shine in turn 4, and MNK would shine in turn 5. I'm 100% ok with that. The majority of the raid community is not.
    I'm glad you're okay with that. I can see why a lot of people aren't okay with that. Yes this is a game where a player can swap jobs at the drop of a hat but each subrole has its own gear progression, and what's more some people get attached to the jobs they play. Someone would, in your scenario, have to co-main MNK and BLM to capitalize on their specialties for their group*, and the jobs don't share gear progression nor are they inherently intuitive to each other.

    I've also already had this "all jobs are the same" argument in another thread. By any meaningful metric you could use to dilute the jobs to being the same, every job becomes the same. AoE specialization means nothing when no endgame content is built around AoE, for instance.

    *Speaking with the understanding we're talking about a tier of raider that cares enough to optimize for every single fight, which would be the same tier of raider that denies a job due to specializing in non-single target in the first place

    I'm not going to sit here and link you 10's or hundreds of threads to show you where the raiding community makes up the majority of the forum community. I can show you very easy that less than 5% of the player base makes up raiding if you absolutely need it. I am not going to waste my time giving you numbers youre too lazy to see just by viewing a few threads though. Its blatantly obvious. Its like me saying the sky is blue, and you point out there are some white clouds and expect me to show you math on the ratio of blue to white, and then when I do you argue that the sky isnt even actually blue its all pigment and light reflection, ... you just want to waste my time and yes I'm gonna pass on that.
    I believe you that less than 5% of the game raid. I don't believe you that 40-50% of the forum's posters are raiders, when anti parser rhetoric is king on the general discussion, and when raiders can be brought up out of left field as the cause of all the game's problems.

    It's more of a dishonest tactic, actually. You've used a bunch of weasel words and "it's obvious"isms to get out of proving a vast majority of your claims. And when called on it, I get more "it's obvious"isms. The sky is not blue when there's a sunset or sunrise; the sky is different hues of blue at different times of day so yes when you make the blanket claim "The sky is blue" I'm going to point up and ask you "What shade, for how long, and what is your evidence?"

    Yes it is very easy. Yoshida himself does it all the time, yet he still strives to please them. Bravo to him.

    I could have easily choose to bring up FATEs or dungeons, or trials, or fishing in fact I'll bring up fishing in my next quote!!! Its actually a better example anyway. Just the raiding one is more relevant to the topic (which is blue mage and how many people do and dont like it.)
    People aren't just mad because BLU can't raid. They're mad because it can't do current lvcap dungeons, it can't do relevant trials, and it can't participate in relevant MSQ. Those three things, I would consider to be the main things you'd want a combat job to be able to do, because they're the content that combat jobs are a vehicle for participation in. You're fine it can't do that, others aren't. All this started because I asked why you singled out raiding of everything BLU can't do. Sure, people are made it can't raid, but that's only one of the many things people are mad it can't do.
    (12)

  8. #38
    Player
    The_Distinguished_Anarchist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    27
    Character
    Guilford Fairclough
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Fawkes View Post




    So like pretty much every game ever, then?
    No, just the terrible ones. Good games generally have a habit of making money right out of the gate.


    It launched in Japan only and came out in North America a year later.
    I am well aware.
    It launched first in May of 2002. It did not start generating profit until after December of 2003. In the time between, it was a toxic money sinkhole for Square.


    Yes I agree, if it was a different game entirely it would have been much worse.
    It was already an awful game.
    Being part of the Final Fantasy franchise is the only thing that kept it from dying in obscurity like FFXIV 1.0 did.
    (10)

  9. #39
    Player
    Elerus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    Posts
    88
    Character
    Elerus Irlith
    World
    Faerie
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by The_Distinguished_Anarchist View Post
    It was a niche title that never achieved any sort of significant recognition beyond the distinction of being the most widely-played Japanese MMO in the world.

    The success it enjoyed was entirely due to the Final Fantasy IP, and having the (at the time) commercial juggernaut of SquareSoft be able to continuously throw money away to support it. It was well over a year after the game's initial release before it attracted enough subscribers to break even.
    If that game had been released by any other company you would not even know it ever existed.
    Ding, right on the money. In many ways it reminded me of Warhammer: Online Age of Reckoning (who here remembers that?) - a game that was deeply and fundamentally flawed and if it wasn't for the beloved IP would have died within months of launch. Instead, it rode on the back of a popular IP that had a huge guaranteed market share all the way to . . . mediocrity. I would hardly deem that a success.
    (8)

  10. #40
    Player
    Cidel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Bastok
    Posts
    1,488
    Character
    Cidel Paratonnerre
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 100
    It's fine if you like how BLU has thus far been implemented in FFXIV despite it's many, many faults and issues, but it doesn't meet the hype they tried to create for it, nor does it fulfill it's basic premise of being a "solo-oriented" job. I played XI for quite a while, and really, the only similarity I feasibly see between XIV and XI's BLU is the spell collecting; which is incredibly streamlined in XIV's open-world and then you hit the spells from dungeons and trials and then the whole thing starts to fall apart.

    This BLU in XIV is no better a representation of what fans liked (and want) from XI than Eureka was (i.e: almost nothing).
    (16)

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