As an FFXI player, thank you for Limited Jobs and BLU SE

[Daniolaut]

Maybe, just maybe, some people play FFXI and FFXIV. They can also appreciate when XIV pulls from XI. This is still Final Fantasy afterall. It’s not like a WoW player asking a Final Fantasy game to be like WoW. That’s a very different thing in my opinion.

I’m all for XIV being more like any previous title, cause I love them all!!

I also love BLU, and every other job!

I’m having fun! Be jealous!

[The_Distinguished_Anarchist]

Maybe, just maybe, some people play FFXI and FFXIV. They can also appreciate when XIV pulls from XI. This is still Final Fantasy afterall. It’s not like a WoW player asking a Final Fantasy game to be like WoW. That’s a very different thing in my opinion.

I’m all for XIV being more like any previous title, cause I love them all!!

I also love BLU, and every other job!

I’m having fun! Be jealous!

The thing is, Final Fantasy XI was an objectively terrible game. The EXP Party system that players developed in response to the twin mechanics of "You lose EXP when you die" and "You have to be in a party to get anything accomplished" was quite possibly the most tedious, mind-numbing, and godawful experience ever placed in a video game. None of that was fun. It was fun in the same way a second job or an emotionally-needy long-distance girlfriend might be considered as such. You had to take the same approach to playing FFXI as you would to building a model ship, or writing a novel, just without any tangible results on the other end of it.

There is a big distinction between having fun doing an activity and putting up with doing an activity with the expectation that a reward would appear at the end of it. The Blue Mage skill grind, and Final Fantasy XI as a whole, are decidedly in the second category.

And even IF you personally have no issue putting up with the grind, there is nothing stopping you from practicing a little empathy for people who aren't. There is also nothing wrong with wanting the job to reach a place where it would actually be fun to play for everyone, instead of just you.

[Jojoya]

And even IF you personally have no issue putting up with the grind, there is nothing stopping you from practicing a little empathy for people who aren't. There is also nothing wrong with wanting the job to reach a place where it would actually be fun to play for everyone, instead of just you.

There will never be a place where any job is fun to everyone. There will always be someone who doesn't like something when you're dealing with hundreds of thousands of different opinions about what makes a job fun.

People have to accept not everything is intended to appeal to them personally. Try it. Decide if you like it. If you do, great. If you don't, move on to the things that you do like instead of trying to take something away from those who do enjoy it by getting it turned into what you personally want.

Also, you probably should review the definition of the word "objective".

[Theodric]

The thing is, Final Fantasy XI was an objectively terrible game.

No, it wasn't. It's a beloved title that is still actively supported in the present day - whereas many MMO's that came after it crashed and burned. If it wasn't for FFXI's success, FFXIV would likely never have been made - and it very likely would not have been remade after 1.0 proved to be a disaster.

[The_Distinguished_Anarchist]

No, it wasn't. It's a beloved title that is still actively supported in the present day - whereas many MMO's that came after it crashed and burned. If it wasn't for FFXI's success, FFXIV would likely never have been made - and it very likely would not have been remade after 1.0 proved to be a disaster.

It was a niche title that never achieved any sort of significant recognition beyond the distinction of being the most widely-played Japanese MMO in the world.

The success it enjoyed was entirely due to the Final Fantasy IP, and having the (at the time) commercial juggernaut of SquareSoft be able to continuously throw money away to support it. It was well over a year after the game's initial release before it attracted enough subscribers to break even.
If that game had been released by any other company you would not even know it ever existed.

[Fawkes]

It was a niche title that never achieved any sort of significant recognition beyond the distinction of being the most widely-played Japanese MMO in the world.

The success it enjoyed was entirely due to the _________ IP, and having the (at the time) commercial juggernaut of ________ be able to continuously throw money away to support it.

So like pretty much every game ever, then?

It was well over a year after the game's initial release before it attracted enough subscribers to break even.

It launched in Japan only and came out in North America a year later.

If that game had been released by any other company you would not even know it ever existed.

Yes I agree, if it was a different game entirely it would have been much worse.

[The_Distinguished_Anarchist]

So like pretty much every game ever, then?

No, just the terrible ones. Good games generally have a habit of making money right out of the gate.

It launched in Japan only and came out in North America a year later.

I am well aware.
It launched first in May of 2002. It did not start generating profit until after December of 2003. In the time between, it was a toxic money sinkhole for Square.

Yes I agree, if it was a different game entirely it would have been much worse.

It was already an awful game.
Being part of the Final Fantasy franchise is the only thing that kept it from dying in obscurity like FFXIV 1.0 did.

[Edax]

Good games generally have a habit of making money right out of the gate.

Strange how all those bad AAA games have a habit of making money right of the gate too. Perhaps there's a correlation.

[Theodric]

It was a niche title that never achieved any sort of significant recognition beyond the distinction of being the most widely-played Japanese MMO in the world.

The success it enjoyed was entirely due to the Final Fantasy IP, and having the (at the time) commercial juggernaut of SquareSoft be able to continuously throw money away to support it. It was well over a year after the game's initial release before it attracted enough subscribers to break even.
If that game had been released by any other company you would not even know it ever existed.

You're overly cynical. FFXI launched in a completely different era and at a time where MMO's were known to be tougher on average than they are in the present day. It's also not a bad thing for an MMO to rise to prominence in large part through brand recognition alone since...that is exactly the case with the most successful MMO's to exist in the present day. Namely WoW, ESO and GW2.

[Elerus]

It was a niche title that never achieved any sort of significant recognition beyond the distinction of being the most widely-played Japanese MMO in the world.

The success it enjoyed was entirely due to the Final Fantasy IP, and having the (at the time) commercial juggernaut of SquareSoft be able to continuously throw money away to support it. It was well over a year after the game's initial release before it attracted enough subscribers to break even.
If that game had been released by any other company you would not even know it ever existed.

Ding, right on the money. In many ways it reminded me of Warhammer: Online Age of Reckoning (who here remembers that?) - a game that was deeply and fundamentally flawed and if it wasn't for the beloved IP would have died within months of launch. Instead, it rode on the back of a popular IP that had a huge guaranteed market share all the way to . . . mediocrity. I would hardly deem that a success.