As an FFXI player, thank you for Limited Jobs and BLU SE

[Awful]

Neither are representations of the way anything worked in XI for better or worse. They're just references like the Crystal Tower is a reference to III or the Floating Continent is a reference to VI.

The hate for XI here from people who apparently played it for a week or not at all is ridiculous.

Crystal Tower wasn't handled by the same guy who did Atma and BLU, Eureka was made by people who worked on XI who try to shoehorn an old grind into a game that already has slow combat in an area where you grind mobs in an artificial area for artificial EXP. There's only 1 kind of progression in this game and gear gets outdated in an instant it's not like in XI from what I read where you can have a BiS item for a years worth of patches that you grinded and got satisfaction.

There's a grind and then there's wasting people's time, BLU and Eureka were both compounds of XI and what they offered myself, I didn't like now I'm not gonna say I hate the game because I never played it but having an old system force its way into relic and a "limited" job isn't showing how XI content was great it's showing me its flaws. There's no satisfaction doing 4 year old content where I can't solo things as a solo class, there's no fun to be had killing mobs and praying for RNG for light and stats in side content for a relic that I just don't care about this expansion, its bad design.

[Daniolaut]

Why'd you bring up raiding out of nowhere?

Wasnt out of no where, you have to read a bit more.

The guy basically tried to imply I was having unjustifiable fun, and should have more empathy for a very very small portion of the playerbase. The fact that most blue mage based threads are split down the middle is a true testament of its acceptance to me than anything. Most of the time the forum community bashes things to oblivion when actually most things go over well.

I personally have even been one to complain about XIV but overall its proven time and time again that its fun and enjoyable to the masses. Currently the game is set to have additional data centers added beyond not only having the UK data center opened, but an additional data center (Light) and the NA data center expanded (Crystal.) Which should be 100% proof that the game is expanding not failing....

The reason for bringing up raiding, is because the larger reason most players do not like blue mage is because it cannot do raids or other similar "end game." Go look at any other blue mage thread.... Also because I know for a fact that raiders make up most of the forum going community. Probably anywhere from 30%-50% if you want a number.

Cool that you quote someone and write something that doesn't have to do anything with what the quoted person wrote.
This post had nothing to do with raiders at all just like your "majority" of the playerbase 100% doesn't like to play stuff that can only do things in PF or solo.

You people need to stop turn every criticism into a raider topic.

In the post you quoted... I responded to him saying how horrible BLU, XI, and "grinding" was, with saying that I am not in the minority and to support the minority on this topic would be an injustice.

I said I was having fun, and that was it. He essentially said I cant possibly justify having fun because clearly XI and BLU is horrible.

The only justification he can have for that is no one was playing it except me, which is the farthest from the truth. Thus why I said what I said.


Edit:

Lastly, I think some of us are allowed to make any comment we want in relation to raids if we so choose, when I'm sure one of the reasons BLU is limited in the first place is because how critical the raiding community is in regards to job balance in the first place.

If you're not aware of what I mean, go view the countless threads/meme's surrounding: "delete MNK" . "delete WHM". "Remove PLD" . "Remove DRK" . so on so forth. Oh and Warrior was bashed to oblivion in 2.0 as well. In fact that job had a complete make over from its original 2.0 debut. Not saying none of these were needed changes, or welcomed changes but you kinda put SE at the throat when it comes to job balance.

I'm illiterate, please, elucidate for me exactly where he brought up BLU isn't fun because it can't raid.

.... You must be, I'm sorry. He didnt bring it up. I did... just like you said....

So you brought it up out of extrapolating things from the post you quoted that weren't actually said. Other similar "end game" includes MSQ and current leveled dungeons, by the way. Damn those raiders tho amirite?

Also gonna need citations on numbers like that if you want them to mean anything.

You're absolutely right, the raiders do cause a bit of grief. Not only to SE but to me yes. Quote from Yoshida himself "The raid is too hard, make it easier. The raid is too easy make it harder, Its difficult to find the balance." Not exact quote but there abouts.

They grief me because they wont let jobs be jobs/different. Not only boosting BLM's dps to one of the highest dps classes in raiding, but now BLU is limited. Let me show you this thread of mine! http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...getting-a-buff

Look at the like count. BLM wasnt viable to raid because of movement. Not saying BLM didnt need the buff, but its now one of the highest single target dps classes. Thankfully since then they also buffed the other classes both damage and TP wise to bring them to at least the same bar. I agree some jobs shouldnt outshine all jobs in one category, but I also dont think they should all be the same. Example is first coil. BLM would shine in turn 4, and MNK would shine in turn 5. I'm 100% ok with that. The majority of the raid community is not.

I'm not going to sit here and link you 10's or hundreds of threads to show you where the raiding community makes up the majority of the forum community. I can show you very easy that less than 5% of the player base makes up raiding if you absolutely need it. I am not going to waste my time giving you numbers youre too lazy to see just by viewing a few threads though. Its blatantly obvious. Its like me saying the sky is blue, and you point out there are some white clouds and expect me to show you math on the ratio of blue to white, and then when I do you argue that the sky isnt even actually blue its all pigment and light reflection, ... you just want to waste my time and yes I'm gonna pass on that.

More power to you, then. I simply asked why you brought them up out of nowhere. Surprising though how easy it is to blame <1% of the playerbase for all the problems, complaints, and overblown criticisms though.

Yes it is very easy. Yoshida himself does it all the time, yet he still strives to please them. Bravo to him.

I could have easily choose to bring up FATEs or dungeons, or trials, or fishing in fact I'll bring up fishing in my next quote!!! Its actually a better example anyway. Just the raiding one is more relevant to the topic (which is blue mage and how many people do and dont like it.)

You've draged raiding into this for no reason. Its nice that you have fun with a job that is basically just a mini game, but again that has nothing to do with raiding.
For me BLU is a waste of time because i can't play it where i want so i'm not even bothering to unlock it, which also has nothing to do with raiding at all.

"For no reason" no not for no reason. Its very relevant to the BLU topic because it cant raid, and you are saying you wont even unlock it or try it because it cant do what you want, which is very much the exact same thing that what so many others on the topic of blue mage have said. So in your attempt to say I brought it up for no reason, follow through with the very reason I brought it up "things BLU cant do."

Raiding being one of them. Its very very very much on topic. Sorry to tell you.

Another example of why I am 100% ok with BLU is because I'm 100% ok with Fisher. Fisher has been implemented in 1.0 actually, and then was changed in 2.0. It has content designed specifically for itself that isnt the "norm" of a disciple of land.
Examples:
-It has its own challenge log entry, separate from MIN and BTN who actually share the same log. So you could argue that its not fair for BTN and MIN to share log exp bonus but then FSH gets its own.
-It has its own mini game that is different from BTN and MIN. In fact its entire tool kit is different from the other two. This also includes now spear fishing.
-It doesnt fit in as well as the other two gathering classes, using the BLU logic of the complaints for BLU, why is FSH so different and not getting as much flak? A large % of FSH items arent using in crafting, especially outside of ALC and CUL.
-Its gathering locations are different as well.
-The way it gathers is vastly different in the sense you sit in one place for extended periods of time as opposed to MIN/BTN whom since 3.0 is hop jump and mount a lot. You almost never use your mount while actually gathering on FSH, since you're rooted. Poor FSH is rooted like BLM, cant move around like BTN and MIN can.


So now I guess i'm bringing fisher out of no where, even though its very much relevant to the logic and topic of how most players criticize BLU.

[Liam_Harper]

Blue is simply a Carnival class.

It has no practical application outside of the Carnival. It's designed so that you get carried through levelling, get carried through dungeons, get carried through EX primals and then you're done. There is no reason at all to form Blu groups for content when you get no extra rewards, can't rez, have inferior dps, inferior tanking ability and one healing ability. It's not designed for playing outside the carnival.

Being a Carnival class has gimped it because it has to be balanced around the carnival. That's why it has tons of the same 130 potency element aoes and gimmicky status abilities, why mighty guard wrecks your damage and Diamondback isn't an immunity. That's why BLU doesn't feel OP.

[Jkap_Goat]

Eureka is a bad example of ffxi, way back then it was a grind that took hours to gain a level and deleveling when you got killed by
a monster ,but now, as someone who started the game 5 months ago ( 75 Mithra DNC/WAR) , leveling is so easy in the game and the trusts are very helpful and powerful.

Also what I love about FFXI is the adventure itself, It's better than FFXIV imo. Through world is huge and dangerous. I'm not some WoL that can just one shot everything.

Also FFXI jobs are hybrids like Dancer, a DPS that can buff, debuff, and heal. That's what so great about them, in FFXIV your locked into the holy Trinity system. Hell BLU can be a tank, healer or DPS in that game depending what spells and gear you use.

[Endeleon]

Y'all haters act like SE just stole years worth of content for releasing BLU, like calm the heckin down and go run end game stuff if that's what you want.

[Sandpark]

I dunno, I've been enjoying it but I'm still not convinced it's fleshed out enough to justify it being side content, nor to make up for the restrictive three-role system in the first place.

Summoner, Bard, Ranger, and Thief all variously don't exist properly or at all in the game because of the role limitations. On the other hand, Blue Mage now exists in its own little side content that seems to not have a purpose outside itself; once you've learned all the spells it's basically "done" because it can't really be used for much currently that you can't just do with any other job that's at 70. So every time a new job is added it can either be screwed up to try and fit into a role it didn't have before, or it can be relegated to its own little sandbox, and neither option sounds that great to me. Although rarely they seem to get it just right like they did with Red Mage.

I didn't mean this to be a complete downer post at first, but I just don't think this suddenly makes the game great for former XI players or players of other FF games in general. Just like relic weapons (that constantly are made pointless) and grinding mobs in Eureka didn't before.

Side content is side content like Raids, Saucer, Eureka, Fates. Things you can do but don't have to do. All content in this game has an end until the next patch or expansion comes outside tome grinding. I don't know why Blue is held to a higher standard, it's called limited.

Once you ding 70 on any job, got your BiS gear, it's basically done until the next patch or expansion. But you can't do what you can on Blue on other jobs. You can't quest all your skills, you don't get an open world kill bonus, you can't do the Carnivale, you have to be tank, DPS, or healer.

Was Blue implemented perfectly? No, or all these threads would not pop up. But it implements a new way of job progression whether people like it or not. If anything, it is a breath of fresh air. This game has tons of other jobs, but they all progress the same way. Same MSQ, same sidequest, same roles, same rules, and same dungeon progression. If you look past the flavor or glamour, you are basically following the same path minus unique job quest or flavor of skills. In offline games there is a thing called replay-ability. A game usually has that label when it offers unique ways to go from beginning to end. Dragon Age does that kind of thing with dialogue choices and origin stories, ESO with race stories.

Love it or hate it. Blue provides a new way to go from beginning to end even though the story is bare bones and does not have alot of various content. But it just came out, some of the other jobs have been out 5 years.

[Daniolaut]

Side content is side content like Raids, Saucer, Eureka, Fates. Things you can do but don't have to do. All content in this game has an end until the next patch or expansion comes outside tome grinding. I don't know why Blue is held to a higher standard, it's called limited.

Once you ding 70 on any job, got your BiS gear, it's basically done until the next patch or expansion. But you can't do what you can on Blue on other jobs. You can't quest all your skills, you don't get an open world kill bonus, you can't do the Carnivale, you have to be tank, DPS, or healer.

Was Blue implemented perfectly? No, or all these threads would not pop up. But it implements a new way of job progression whether people like it or not. If anything, it is a breath of fresh air. This game has tons of other jobs, but they all progress the same way. Same MSQ, same sidequest, same roles, same rules, and same dungeon progression. If you look past the flavor or glamour, you are basically following the same path minus unique job quest or flavor of skills. In offline games there is a thing called replay-ability. A game usually has that label when it offers unique ways to go from beginning to end. Dragon Age does that kind of thing with dialogue choices and origin stories, ESO with race stories.

Bravo

/10char

[Ilan]

Wasnt out of no where, you have to read a bit more.

The guy basically tried to imply I was having unjustifiable fun, and should have more empathy for a very very small portion of the playerbase. The fact that most blue mage based threads are split down the middle is a true testament of its acceptance to me than anything. Most of the time the forum community bashes things to oblivion when actually most things go over well.

I personally have even been one to complain about XIV but overall its proven time and time again that its fun and enjoyable to the masses. Currently the game is set to have additional data centers added beyond not only having the UK data center opened, but an additional data center (Light) and the NA data center expanded (Crystal.) Which should be 100% proof that the game is expanding not failing....

The reason for bringing up raiding, is because the larger reason most players do not like blue mage is because it cannot do raids or other similar "end game." Go look at any other blue mage thread.... Also because I know for a fact that raiders make up most of the forum going community. Probably anywhere from 30%-50% if you want a number.





In the post you quoted... I responded to him saying how horrible BLU, XI, and "grinding" was, with saying that I am not in the minority and to support the minority on this topic would be an injustice.

I said I was having fun, and that was it. He essentially said I cant possibly justify having fun because clearly XI and BLU is horrible.

The only justification he can have for that is no one was playing it except me, which is the farthest from the truth. Thus why I said what I said.

You've draged raiding into this for no reason. Its nice that you have fun with a job that is basically just a mini game, but again that has nothing to do with raiding.
For me BLU is a waste of time because i can't play it where i want so i'm not even bothering to unlock it, which also has nothing to do with raiding at all.

[TheHeavenAbyss]

You can say "If you don't like BLU, go do something else" or "Why complain so much about BLU when there so many other classes to play with?", but that's the thing. Blue Mage is a beloved classic FF job that many people wanted to play with and possibly main like all the others, and they just don't like that that job can't be used in stuff like dungeons, raids, trials and MSQ like the others, which is most of the main content of the game. And not everyone is tired of that content.

I know that, if they announced Samurai, only to then say that it couldn't be used for most of the main content of the game, I would be disappointed. "Don't like Samurai? Play another class for main content. There are many". Yeah, but I wanted to play Samurai, it's why I wanted it in the game in the first place.

I'm not against a new type of content. I'm not even against stuff like Eureka. I don't even touch Savage and Extreme. I play mostly for the story and some casual dungeoning/raiding. But you shouldn't have to sacrifice a beloved FF job to appease people that appear to be bored of what most of this game is about.

[Dualgunner]

Wasnt out of no where, you have to read a bit more.

I'm illiterate, please, elucidate for me exactly where he brought up BLU isn't fun because it can't raid.

The reason for bringing up raiding, is because the larger reason most players do not like blue mage is because it cannot do raids or other similar "end game." Go look at any other blue mage thread.... Also because I know for a fact that raiders make up most of the forum going community. Probably anywhere from 30%-50% if you want a number.

So you brought it up out of extrapolating things from the post you quoted that weren't actually said. Other similar "end game" includes MSQ and current leveled dungeons, by the way. Damn those raiders tho amirite?

Also gonna need citations on numbers like that if you want them to mean anything.

Lastly, I think some of us are allowed to make any comment we want in relation to raids if we so choose, when I'm sure one of the reasons BLU is limited in the first place is because how critical the raiding community is in regards to job balance in the first place.

More power to you, then. I simply asked why you brought them up out of nowhere. Surprising though how easy it is to blame <1% of the playerbase for all the problems, complaints, and overblown criticisms though.