4.4: Role Action slots increased to 10. Thoughts?

[Deceptus]

And, as Iscah said, it still removes the requirement of having to level THM to 26 for Swiftcast or GLA to 22 for Provoke—both of which were a problem in HW. My experiences are innumerable when it comes to the DRKs that didn’t have Provoke, or the healers that didn’t have Swiftcast in level 60 content.

Mandatory actions such as Provoke should never have been cross role actions. They should have been native to the base class kit.

[HyoMinPark]

Mandatory actions such as Provoke should never have been cross role actions. They should have been native to the base class kit.

And giving them to their base job (can’t just do base class since some don’t have classes, and the developers are doing all they can to phase out the class system anyways) wouldn’t solve the button bloat complaint that you brought up in the OP. So tanks all now innately know Provoke and Rampart instead of them being role skills—it’s still using up the same amount of hotbar space.

Then there's also the fact that the class/job skills are auto-added to your hotbar when you unlock them, but the role skills are not. And there are people that manage to miss the existence of role skills altogether.

When you’re leveling up a class/job in a role, there is a pop up that appears saying “You learn the Role Skill xxxxx!” They may not automatically appear on your hotbar, but the game still tells you that you learned them. People “miss” them for the same reason they “miss” what the very skills already listed on their hotbar do, or “miss” the message that says “you can now accept a new class/job quest”: from not paying attention. You can hold people’s hands all they want, and they’ll still miss things.

[kikix12]

When you’re leveling up a class/job in a role, there is a pop up that appears saying “You learn the Role Skill xxxxx!” They may not automatically appear on your hotbar, but the game still tells you that you learned them.

I know that. And I kept saying that people miss it by ignorance and what not.

However, even when I long since knew about the role skills and what not, I came across the pop-up appearing when I was leveling another class while for whatever reason I didn't pay enough attention to it. I don't know, I think it was in the middle of combat? Possibly. It was a skill whose icon I was not familiar with (some of the trash skills I never even use). Afterwards I was wondering where it was, since I wanted to check what exactly it did.
Since I knew about the role skills by then, it finally shone on me that it was that (well, I just opened the skill menu and looked at the tabs, so yeah...). But it shows that people can sometimes honestly miss such things.

Sure, that happening every time one of several skills is learned is a bit much...but hey.


What I'm saying here is that there is simply no reason not to do that. If players are too ignorant/lazy/otherwise restricted to learn how to use the tools they have?! Sure. The game shouldn't accommodate for that by becoming brain-dead one-button masher. But if it is at no cost to gameplay, giving unnecessary extra hoops is just irritating. Even as a more experiences player, it irks me that if I level a new class I'll have to go those extra steps to add and never remove some of those skills. Not because it's too much to do or it takes too much time. But...why?! Rampart will be on every tank, in every content, in every case 100% of the time. It's just stupid, excessive, pointless. If it had any sensible reason behind its existence...fine. But there is none. It just have negatives from players perspectives, and saves virtually nothing to the developers. Because no matter how terrible the code is, there is absolutely no way I would believe it's not just a matter of copy-paste or adding an extra flag, depending on how they decided to make it.

[HyoMinPark]

snip on mobile.

The problem with them auto-adding role skills to your hotbar is with the design of, not only the role skills system, but the class/job system.

You start off in the game as a class, which has access to all 10 slots - thereby they theoretically have access to all 10 role skills. The last slot (and skill) are unlocked in the late 40s (level 48, if I recall correctly); you're never going to take a class beyond level 30 (or you shouldn't anyways). Jobs, the ones you take past level 30, have access to 5 slots (currently); again with the last slot/skill learned in the late 40s.

5 slots (currently); 10 skills. If auto-adding them were a thing, how does the game determine which skills to auto-add? First 5? Last 5? Middle 5? Random 5? If it auto-adds them all, how does it determine which to equip? First 5? Last 5? Middle 5? Random 5? None at all?

We all know it was a failed concept, this illusion of "choice" with the role skills system. But that design intent - however much of a failure it may be - is probably why auto-adding isn't a thing. That, and the number of skills learned versus available slots. That's my take on it anyways.

[kikix12]

The problem with them auto-adding role skills to your hotbar is with the design of, not only the role skills system, but the class/job system.

Um...I think you grossly misunderstood me.

I've been considering the "role actions" a failure since before it even came. When it came, I though I gave it too much credit still. After actually using it for a bit...I came to the conclusion that people at Square probably don't really test stuff like that at all because it never should have made it to the game like that.

These skills should be part of the classes main kit. That's what I kept saying in this thread, including in the post I assume you're responding to. "Mandatory" skills should be gotten with levels as part of class/job, just like Ruin, Cure, Hard Shot etc. are. I even specifically, explicitly said why it is an issue with the role actions system BECAUSE the skills cannot be auto-added to the hot bars due to it being...well...it.