Realistic 5.0 Jobs

[Kazrah]

So let me try to fit in the title of realistic jobs we might get. For starters, it'd be astounding if we didn't get a tank and healer not because we need more tanks and healers (an argument which will go on until the end of MMORPGs), but because we could use more tank and healer options to keep tank and healer players enticed into continuing with those roles in addition to whatever sliver of players switch from DPS.

For the next healer, I see three possibilities. Dancer might come up simply due to player demand along with Yoshi saying no on it for Stormblood because he wanted it "just right". Chemist is another high-demand job added onto its potential lore tie-in to the famed alchemists of Thavnair, but a potential for weaponization or other means of delivering their goods at a distance means that it'd probably be incorporated into a different job. Lastly, Oracle was a job brought up by Yoshi during a couple of interviews as what could've been the third job for Stormblood, meaning there might be some resources for it leftover. Although it might not look it, all three of these jobs could get away with wearing Mending gear, especially if you think about seeing Red Mage in a robe and realizing that it's almost as visually nonsensical. All three of these jobs would have to use MP as a prime resource just because it's much easier to balance. Lastly, it would need a completely new main healing system (WHM uses hots, SCH has bubbles, AST has either/or), which would probably be the biggest obstacle for a new healer.

Due to the changes Stormblood made to tank gear and unless those changes get reverted in 5.0, the next tank will HAVE to be another tin can tank in Fending gear. Itemization has unfortunately limited more entertaining possibilities for tanks, but what this does mean is that the next tank would likely follow a dream of Yoshi of having jobs exclusive to FFXIV. Sure, we could see some possible elements from other jobs such as Blue Mage or some other job not traditionally identified as a tank incorporated it, but this next tank would most likely be something entirely new.

[Mahrze]

Due to the changes Stormblood made to tank gear and unless those changes get reverted in 5.0, the next tank will HAVE to be another tin can tank in Fending gear. Itemization has unfortunately limited more entertaining possibilities for tanks, but what this does mean is that the next tank would likely follow a dream of Yoshi of having jobs exclusive to FFXIV. Sure, we could see some possible elements from other jobs such as Blue Mage or some other job not traditionally identified as a tank incorporated it, but this next tank would most likely be something entirely new.

This is kinda moot since AF gear rarely bends to the fending archetype. PLD's 4.0 AF gear is not a tin can nor is WAR's (I'd say DRK too but that one is debatable) So AF and maybe dungeon gear can break said pattern.

I'd contest Chemist and Oracle since the dev team usually bends to requests and Dancer, Blue Mage and something with a Gunblade are the most common things they have seen and likely still see in the lead up to 5.0. Enough people are betting Alphi will have an Alisaie moment in the 4.0 story too.

[Linx0r]

Well now we have seen a bo staff in play, so what class can use that?

[Ilenya]

As for a melee healer, something like Nidhogg springs to mind, with his cleave. Unless you learn when every cleave happens for every fight, you will have the potential to get cleaved and wrecked, but then, that Bard at the back didn't move quick enough and now you have to travel across most of the map to heal them. Yes, you could add movement abilities, but that leaves less for other things, plus I don't think it's what people had in mind with a melee healer, practically instant teleporting across the battlefield to heal everyone, then you have AoE heals, which will basically be a massive AoE around the user etc.

I think you are misunderstanding the idea of "melee healer"

The idea was for a healer who works in melee range, doing damage that way, but still having your standard range for your primary (Cure style) heals.

[KisaiTenshi]

I think you are misunderstanding the idea of "melee healer"

The idea was for a healer who works in melee range, doing damage that way, but still having your standard range for your primary (Cure style) heals.

A Melee healer is traditionally what the Cleric (priest) is in D&D style systems. They wield maces. If you want to get into it, the RPG Cleric is actually one of the few D&D things not directly based on Tolkien, but rather the kind of demon/vampire hunter (think a much earlier interpretation of Van Helsing.) To avoid confusion with the Paladin (who is a holy knight, or crusader.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleric...ns_%26_Dragons)

Reluctant to shed blood, clerics are limited to blunt, bludgeoning weapons unless allowed other weapons by their dogma/mythos. Being trained for battle as well as spiritual works, they may use any armor or shield.

The thing is, taken at face value the "white mage" is the Cleric in FF, and had FFXIV not turned the Conjurer into one, the Conjurer would have became the Geomancer, and the Thaumaturge (which is the actual "Priest" in this game) would have had White Mage or Black Mage or Red Mage as evolution points. These decisions were made during 1.x and are thus impossible to go back in time and change.

Suffice it to say, I think we're seeing the consequences of making those changes in 1.x contradict the lore now. Because in 1.x the only gear that was class locked was the main hand gear. That I recall. The correct lore for the WHM would not have the WHM being able to cast any destructive magic other than Holy, and Holy would only work on undead, vampires. But there's also no traditional "power of god compels thee" type of aspect to FFXIV's classes since "we" are the ones being compelled by Hydaelyn already. It's right there in the name "Warrior of Light"

[Ilenya]

A Melee healer is traditionally what the Cleric (priest) is in D&D style systems. They wield maces. If you want to get into it, the RPG Cleric is actually one of the few D&D things not directly based on Tolkien, but rather the kind of demon/vampire hunter (think a much earlier interpretation of Van Helsing.) To avoid confusion with the Paladin (who is a holy knight, or crusader.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleric...ns_%26_Dragons)

Unless my knowledge of D&D is more lacking than I thought, Clerics can heal at range, yes? No need to be running around except for your most powerful heals that are touch only.

[KisaiTenshi]

Unless my knowledge of D&D is more lacking than I thought, Clerics can heal at range, yes? No need to be running around except for your most powerful heals that are touch only.

Clerics in a traditional sense use prayers. Those prayers come in a variety of things, and alignment matters in some of those games (eg turning or destroying undead is something only lawful clerics can do, while chaotic ones can not.) The light cure and serious cure requires touch. In other games an evil cleric can only inflict wounds, not cure them, but they may also be able to command undead. 5th edition Clerics are still touch based for those basic cures, but the "regen" healing word and Heal (eq Esuna) can be casted at distance, and are high level and expensive. A mass heal is also distance, high level and expensive.

There's also systems like d20 that use the same names for spells but different rules.

FFXIV's White Mage is derived from those same early CRPG versions of Cleric/Priest which in turn were based on pre-AD&D or early D&D content. The thing that would throw a huge monkey wrench into into how White Mage works is if they actually had to invoke their Deity of the twelve that you selected at character creation.

[Kazrah]

This is kinda moot since AF gear rarely bends to the fending archetype. PLD's 4.0 AF gear is not a tin can nor is WAR's (I'd say DRK too but that one is debatable) So AF and maybe dungeon gear can break said pattern..

What I mean by "tin can tank" is that they're going to wear Fending gear as opposed to any other gear type (i.e. Striking, Casting, Maiming, etc.), not the visual factor.

The other thing to bear in mind is that Chemist is in the top three right now for most demanded jobs that could actually happen, and I would still argue Oracle as a possibility simply because it'd be easier from a development standpoint to work on something they likely still have resources for.

And some final food for thought: if Dark Knight was requested as a DPS and released as a tank, and Samurai requested as a tank and released as a DPS, what makes you think Dancer would be a healer when it could just as easily be a melee DPS in Scouting gear?

[Mikey_R]

I think you are misunderstanding the idea of "melee healer"

The idea was for a healer who works in melee range, doing damage that way, but still having your standard range for your primary (Cure style) heals.

It seems I did misunderstand. However, I don't see the appeal. Assuming it has about 3-4 single damaging attacks, like the other healers, you either have a DoT and a short combo, or you can use them without combos, each adding a debuff and maybe one pure damage for filler. I wouldn't expect to add positionals as that is another thing to juggle whilst healing. However, it might appeal to some, so I'm not going to deny them that possibility just because I don't see the appeal.

And some final food for thought: if Dark Knight was requested as a DPS and released as a tank, and Samurai requested as a tank and released as a DPS, what makes you think Dancer would be a healer when it could just as easily be a melee DPS in Scouting gear?

They don't need another Melee DPS :P

[Miles_Maelstrom]

I doubt that they'll add 2 healers though, and geomancers are being shown everywhere in this expansion.

I doubt they are going to add any dps next expansion. Remember they cut back to 2 and they were both dds this expansion