What is casual / hardcore player?

[Sephrick]

You must put words into people's mouth quite often, you're quite awesome at it. I am well aware that there is no journey in XIV right now, but unlikely for the same reasons you make (as undoubtedly, FFXI was in fact quite the journey pre-abyssea).

No. XI pre- and post- Abyssea was the same. Stand in place and repeat minimal actions until you're at cap. That's not a journey, that's doing random crap that is completely disjointed from any semblance of a story to get the the next hurdle.

And I didn't put words in your mouth. You said "casuals have their heads up their asses because they don't like the journey."

Currently XIV's "journey" is just like XI's. In other words, there isn't one. But that has nothing to do with how quickly one levels. It could take a full year to ding 50. It doesn't change the fact that, just like in XI, all one has to do is engage in the same mindless unchallanging mass slaughter of random mobs to get there.

To me, that's not a journey. It's just a very blatant time sink devoid of content.

[TheFatHousecat]

That's a little bit of a cheap shot.

You take enough cheap shots of your own; I think Dragon's entitled to them just as much as you are ;3

[Jennestia]

No. XI pre- and post- Abyssea was the same. Stand in place and repeat minimal actions until you're at cap. That's not a journey

I recall quite the journey when I first began (in 2002) then going through all of the storylines with friends and taking on all of the content that were tied to the story (e.g eventually unlocking end-game content.) There's more to it but XIV's current journey is really nothing because they're eventually trying to cater to people who believe the game is only in the instances or how quick you're propelled to level cap.

Post abyssea you level to 30 then hit cap, most people don't even bother with doing the story anymore.

[Dragon]

No. XI pre- and post- Abyssea was the same. Stand in place and repeat minimal actions until you're at cap. That's not a journey, that's doing random crap that is completely disjointed from any semblance of a story to get the the next hurdle.

And I didn't put words in your mouth. You said "casuals have their heads up their asses because they don't like the journey."

Currently XIV's "journey" is just like XI's. In other words, there isn't one. But that has nothing to do with how quickly one levels. It could take a full year to ding 50. It doesn't change the fact that, just like in XI, all one has to do is engage in the same mindless unchallanging mass slaughter of random mobs to get there.

To me, that's not a journey. It's just a very blatant time sink devoid of content.

Nah, FFXI was most definitely a journey. But you of course wouldn't know that because you just went with the mainstream opinions about leveling, and chances are you never bothered socializing in any party; as a matter of fact, if you want to define a journey as something you're doing that's not repeated, then I have news for you: no mainstream MMORPG/RPG is a journey at all. At the end of the day, they all are repeating content. Fallout, Elder Scrolls, Mass Effect, Dragon Age, but most especially SWTOR (for all it is is just another grind, but with lamer graphics, lamer animations, and the lamest storyline ever put together, and this is coming from a BioWare/KOTOR fan that was waiting to just beta test for over two years now), are not filled with a journey by your silly definition. Grinds can be and necessarily are in fact journeys, just not necessarily so for the typical casual player.

Oh you did put words into my mouth by insinuating that I suggested FFXIV had a journey, though I've to admit it has a much better journey than SWTOR could ever possibly have.

[Sephrick]

Nah, FFXI was most definitely a journey. But you of course wouldn't know that because you just went with the mainstream opinions about leveling, and chances are you never bothered socializing in any party; as a matter of fact, if you want to define a journey as something you're doing that's not repeated, then I have news for you: no mainstream MMORPG/RPG is a journey at all. At the end of the day, they all are repeating content. Fallout, Elder Scrolls, Mass Effect, Dragon Age, but most especially SWTOR (for all it is is just another grind, but with lamer graphics, lamer animations, and the most lame-ass storyline ever put together, and this is coming from a BioWare/KOTOR fan that was waiting to just beta test for over two years now), are not filled with a journey by your silly definition. Grinds can be and necessarily are in fact journeys, just not for the typical casual player.

Oh you did put words into my mouth by insinuating that I suggested FFXIV had a journey, though I've to admit it has a much better journey than SWTOR could ever possibly have.

Nah, there's a difference engaging battles and mindless slaughter. That's the difference for me. If it's a "journey" I want to feel that I'm participating in gameplay at all times.

CoP, level cap quests, coffer key hunting, Assaults, Nyzul Isle. Those were all a "journey" because they took time but had story around them.

Killing 30,000 little blue crabs was in no way a "journey" because it was inconsequential and had no bearing on Vana'diel.

And I never said you were suggestion XIV had a journey. I merely said your "heads in their asses" line was a cheap shot then presented my thoughts on what a "journey" should be.

[PSxpert2011]

This Topic is getting old, lame and over-rated. LEt me make it clear so everyone can understand and no amount of complaining can change this: Casual players play Final Fantasy offline (maybe other games to kill time)and log on to ff11 and 14 to chat with friends. Hard-cores, enthusiast and those other players who log on everyday possible to take on events and do important things for themselves and their friends periodically and that's what the MMO was designed for and what SE should be focusing on at this time and in the future.

Later... casuals could get anything they want(like what happen in FF-11).

[Jennestia]

CoP, level cap quests, coffer key hunting, Assaults, Nyzul Isle. Those were all a "journey" because they took time but had story around them.

Would you rather it be called peregrinations? CoP alone was one of the biggest journeys in FFXI and it's not because of time commitment either -- Not only was it also the first real year of XI being live out west, it's also the first real showcase of an active storyline in an MMO at that time. A journey in terms of gaming is indeed about doing quests, playing with friends, watching your character grow not only in terms of gameplay but as a character and so on.

XIV lacks that aspect, while it is only the first storyline, even the vanilla storyline of XI in comparison had much more character growth. A journey is just something that's done to reach a goal, when you're propelled to end-game and then the game 'begins'..that's not a journey in this sense.

This is why casual gamers are generally the ones hardcore gamers look down on, because they "have no time for it" yet want to play an MMORPG. There's nothing wrong with it, but this is why there's a very obvious rift between Hardcore and Casual gamers even though those terms in itself is your own perception.

[AmyRae]

Of course, this... and the following.

Hardcore = valuing the journey (levels and midgame content) to the destination (endgame content).
Casual = can't get their head out of their butt to understand the journey is just as important as the destination.

You've got it backwards. Considering that casual players take their time going through the content since they progress at a slower pace, I'd venture to say it's actually the casual players who value the journey more than hardcore players.

It's not casual players spending thousands of hours doing repetitive tasks collecting endgame trinkets. That's certainly the primary activity of hardcore players, however, and there really isn't much a journey to talk about there.

The story and quests are probably the most compelling things to a casual player in an MMO. I can't imagine why you would think differently. Why else would a casual player even play? They aren't the ones in a rush to get to the oppressive endgame grinds, that's for sure.

[fusional]

Casual: People who play the game for fun
Hardcore: People who ruin the game by constantly complaining

is that why most of the nonconstructive complaining in this very forum is done by casuals with unrealistic, selfish and often downright silly demands based on their own subjective personal perception/preference (complete with thick aura of entitlement)?

[Sephrick]

is that why most of the nonconstructive complaining in this very forum is done by casuals with unrealistic, selfish and often downright silly demands based on their own subjective personal perception/preference (complete with thick aura of entitlement)?

Show me one post like that and I'll show you 30 saying the game is too "easymode" because we can play on our own terms.