The virtual currency "Moogle Coins" in the FFXIV Companion app must be removed

[MilanFrozen]

Hardly, there is just more people sensationalizing things as usual. They do this anytime something is added outside the standard sub.

And as I watch you slide down a slippery slope while screaming 'there is no slippery slope' I just wonder why you would accept something terrible when you could have better.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

And as I watch you slide down a slippery slope while screaming 'there is no slippery slope' I just wonder why you would accept something terrible when you could have better.

I've been here 7 years. People have been saying this since 2014. In fact, there was a thread titled "the many deaths of FFXIV" back then too. Games still here.

[MilanFrozen]

I've been here 7 years. People have been saying this since 2014. In fact, there was a thread titled "the many deaths of FFXIV" back then too. Games still here.

What does that have to do with you defending terrible systems under the veil that 'It's not as bad as people make it out to be' when it is. Literally offering things to the players such as more inventory space for a price and then turning around and saying 'we can't give more inventory space due to limitations of the game' literally, LITERALLY lying to the playerbase.

[Beckett]

Hello~
Trying to play this game again, is it pay to win now?

Technically, but in a way that won't actually effect the majority of players. If one of your primary play motivations is to make gil via the Market Board, then you'd better prepare your wallet because the most efficient way to do that is to pay real life money for all the extra retainers and soon the premium phone app as well (plus in-app purchases).

If you're not a hardcore user of the Market Board, then you've got nothing to worry about. At least for now.

[Beckett]

What does that have to do with you defending terrible systems under the veil that 'It's not as bad as people make it out to be' when it is. Literally offering things to the players such as more inventory space for a price and then turning around and saying 'we can't give more inventory space due to limitations of the game' literally, LITERALLY lying to the playerbase.

While I agree with the spirit of what you're saying, I don't think they've ever said they absolutely couldn't add more inventory space, they just always say that it would be "very difficult". Lots of extra cash is certainly a good motivator to do the "very difficult" work of adding more inventory.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

What does that have to do with you defending terrible systems under the veil that 'It's not as bad as people make it out to be' when it is. Literally offering things to the players such as more inventory space for a price and then turning around and saying 'we can't give more inventory space due to limitations of the game' literally, LITERALLY lying to the playerbase.

They cannot easily add more personal inventory space, I believe they have gone over the specifics of this in the past, yet people ignore that and use the retainers as a reason why they are "lying"

[Vstarstruck]

It's not pay-to-win if you can't buy some kind of battle booster that makes you stronger or receive less damage or something.

So you have a narrow scope what defines pay to win.
You do not see an advantage someone has when they have 8 chrs with 10 retainers each vs 8 chrs 2 retainers each? It is a huge difference and a huge advantage, that is how you define pay to win. paying real money for anadvantage. Then this goes even further, where this market is based on undercut spamming, and now it lets people undercut spam on the go. I had to listen someone complain about how they price changed an item for every split second for 1 hour, now what would happen if someone was on the go paying tons of money to compete with those 2? Or do you not realize how often sometimes price changes happens?

Also you talk about stress on the servers, what about stress some people have to deal with, with bad inventory UI(combination of chobobo bag, retainers, personal inventory, and all the time it takes to keep pulling up menus?

You are right, I will not be able post here in 13 days from now. I refuse to support this blantant rip off to the players. Pushing items from retainer to retainer should come with the basic game. If you are so worried about server costs, how do f2p games stay aflot? This is a f2p model while giving us a sub cost on top of it. Nothing will convince me they have that much server stress unless they are trying to pass down costs of their poor workarounds from bad 1.0 coding. If the 1.0 coding and the core of this game is THAT bad, recode it, or shut the game down to make a brand new game. Just because I am not paying for the game no more, does not stop me from sharing my views how I think they are taking too much advantage of people that don't think about things deeply or simply don't care they are getting a fair value.

No I disagree they should have any kind of server stress that needs 33 dollars per person per month. You know how mad this made me? I got 5 hours of sleep and I couldn't go back to sleep after my SO told me (who knew id flip over this) ended up being right, scary tbh... This is really a new low, locking a basic feature behind added sub on a sub model game. Sorry being able to move items from retainer to retainer is basic sub cost, not premium.

I'd like this quote to be remembered:

Indeed that's exactly the problem. These kind of "products" are made with little effort and only need to be produced once and can be replicated indefinitely basically for free for the company, making millions of dollars at virtually no cost in comparison. I'm not at all surprised that a company will do these things. If we as individuals could make money in such a manner...wouldn't we do that as well? The answer is, probably. Yeah. If we could get away with it and didn't care about others. But there is a famous saying, you know? "A fool and their money are easily parted". It becomes this thought process of, "If someone is stupid enough to spend their money on that, then who are we to judge?" and this line of thinking becomes the defense for doing these practices in the first place. But it's a terrible practice. It's basically saying "I don't care about the people who are supporting me, I only want to see how much money I can make out of them".

But here's the thing; you can't necessarily fault a company for doing this. After all, as I just said above... most people would do this if they could get away with it. That's why it's so dangerous to have people defending this kind of practice. I have absolutely no qualms with SE trying to make money - or any company, for that matter. But I want them to EARN that money from my pocket. If you are going to make me pay for something extra outside of my sub fees, then first of all I want to see that you actually put effort into it, none of this low effort BS we're seeing with this app. But secondly, I want to see that my money that I am spending extra on your MMO is actually going back into that MMO to improve it. I'm not seeing that with FFXIV as much as it pains me to say. I mean, even the forums. I can't post this without being cut off from a word limit that means nothing since you can just edit a post anyway. And the game itself....don't even get me started on all the issues.

And the worst part is, the way companies that DO get away with it manage to do so is, as you pretty much mentioned, by making it "optional". But absolutely every little thing that is not directly tied to the main story questline is "optional" if you want to push it that way. Do you want to level everything on one character? Well, honestly that's optional. You can just make a new character. What if they made you have to pay to unlock additional jobs? Do you want access to glamour at all? Optional. Want to pay for that too? There are so many things in this game that are "optional", it becomes a very dangerous and slippery slope to just say "well, it's optional so it's fine that they charge us extra for it", especially when not only are some of the things ridiculously overpriced, but also MONTHLY. Although I think we should be given additional space for free due to the item bloat of this game, I would honestly be happy if I could just buy an additional retainer for a flat $20, one time. I honestly don't even buy the bullshit excuse of "they need the money to pay for the server space for your extra storage" because if you fail to pay for your retainer, you lose the retainer...but when you get them back all of your stuff remains. Which means, regardless of if you are actively paying or not, they are storing that data.

They cannot easily add more personal inventory space, I believe they have gone over the specifics of this in the past, yet people ignore that and use the retainers as a reason why they are "lying"

It is made up excuses, because if that was true they would not be giving us so much item bloat, that is why I believe they are lying, on top of the fact oh they can add magically more when increasing our sub cost.

Please look at the bold, all you are attempting to achieve is making this game lousy for the rest of us.

What does that have to do with you defending terrible systems under the veil that 'It's not as bad as people make it out to be' when it is. Literally offering things to the players such as more inventory space for a price and then turning around and saying 'we can't give more inventory space due to limitations of the game' literally, LITERALLY lying to the playerbase.

Nothing, your replying to a white knight.

[DPZ2]

The thing is we're already paying a premium subscription every month on top of paying the mogstation for some glam items.
...
It just isn't acceptable for a subscription based game (of which you also need to purchase the game AND the expansions) to implement F2P schemes, period.
...
But them implementing in app currency and giving you access to real benefits is a tell tale sign that we're getting F'd up the A.

Welcome to the MMO scene in 2018 -- er, 2008.

Couple of points:
1. You can pay a subscription and not pay for anything on the mogstation and still raid, craft, quest.

2. You can now purchase the "Complete Edition" of the game for what a typical PS4 game costs. If you invested in the game back in ARR and got the expansion to HW, Stormblood is about half that cost.

3. I suspect that the 'moogle currency' is a way of making it less profitable for gil sellers to terrorize the Market Board once the app goes online.

[MilanFrozen]

While I agree with the spirit of what you're saying, I don't think they've ever said they absolutely couldn't add more inventory space, they just always say that it would be "very difficult". Lots of extra cash is certainly a good motivator to do the "very difficult" work of adding more inventory.

I see this as a tomato, tomato type of thing because really what I am arguing is that they're trying to make it out like they need to charge for it. Why is it not like WoW getting new bags and whatnot? The point is that they're charging for something that they shouldn't be. Then again I'm the kinda person who doesn't think they should even be charging for the extra retainers so I guess my argument might be seen as extreme or whatever. All I was trying to say is that I see this as SE slowly closing their grip on the players to see just how much they can squeeze.

[RiyahArp]

You do not see an advantage someone has when they have 8 chrs with 10 retainers each vs 8 chrs 2 retainers each?.

There's literally nothing to spend 80 retainers worth of gil on in the game. The gil gives no real advantage in any content. Gil is borderline useless in this game, as there is no real roadblocks to attempting to get what you want. Like in FFXI, gil was important because a lot of NM gear was purely roadblocked and u needed to buy it, or the game made you spend ridiculous mounts of gil on consummables like arrows or ninja tools. If you wanted a relic there, you needed to spend tens of millions of gil on buying dynamis currency, and raids cost millions of gil to enter. Here gil is a joke.