Idea: Class split idea for all jobs

[Reynhart]

I would also argue most classes really gain their identity at 30 and therefore get the feel for how they function. Almost all Jobs/classes get their 3 chain at 30.

Which is still at least 20 levels earlier that what futue jobs will start at, if we follow the current trend.

More importantly, I think branching could have a very good impact on healer and tank population. First of all, if there was a branching, I think each class should branch into 1 DPS and either 1 tank or 1 healer. This way, if you level a DPS, you'll have one of the other leveled too. And since it's already leveled and you'll be familiar with how the core class works (Like the basic WS rotation), you might be more comfortable switching to this role than you'll be to level it from scratch.

Still doesn't solve the weapon issue, you have 2 jobs using the same weapons

They're not using the same weapon, they're using the same weapon type. Exactly like SCH and SMN do.

Could you imagine trying to add say even just 4 new split path jobs? You would have to balance them, make it so they can utilize the weapon of the base class or add in 4 sets of new weapons, soul crystals, allow them to use all the gear for that role.

Still, you'd have a big part of their toolkit that's already designed, so you wouln't have to create as much skills. As for gear and weapon, it's not that big of a deal. The itemization is so bland that you can pretty much foresee the stats on each item simply by looking at the ilvl. If THM would branch into a DPS role, you'd just add it to every non-job-specific caster gear.

[Wintersandman]

Which is still at least 20 levels earlier that what futue jobs will start at, if we follow the current trend.

I just don't see a reason to start off at 1. If most classes really don't have an opportunity to learn how they function until 30.

Snip.

You ignored the rest of the thread where I already discussed not wanting to start off at 1. Also SMN/SCH both use books.

[Reynhart]

I just don't see a reason to start off at 1. If most classes really don't have an opportunity to learn how they function until 30.

So, I'll rephrase my statement. I'd rather start new classes at level 30 and leveling several jobs at the same time than starting new jobs at level 50...or above.

[Wintersandman]

So, I'll rephrase my statement. I'd rather start new classes at level 30 and leveling several jobs at the same time than starting new jobs at level 50...or above.

I myself was dismayed when SAM and RDM started off at 50... next expac they may start off at 60 which would be just silly but... It's the opposite effect of having to start off at 1. You have so many abilities it is hard to determine how the job functions without spending time reading all the tooltips. So now we overwhelm vs underwhelm. I think 30 is the golden point to start off but by then no point in having classes.

[Reynhart]

I think 30 is the golden point to start off but by then no point in having classes.

Considering class skills go up to level 50, it would still be useful for having a common backbone for multiple jobs. If we keep one job for one class, then, yes, classes are useless now that the cross-class skills are gone.
And, if classes are useless, then, again, the whole armory system is too, since Crystals are enough to lock your job.

[Wintersandman]

And, if classes are useless, then, again, the whole armory system is too, since Crystals are enough to lock your job.

Well and I don't see them ever reverting that since they have to support 1.0 players.

[Reynhart]

Well and I don't see them ever reverting that since they have to support 1.0 players.

I am a 1.0 player, and I liked it back then even if it had a lot of flaws. Personally, I felt a bit left out the moment the game was so much streamlined that it removed any kind of thought behind how you'd "build" your character, wether by its skills or its gear.
At that point, I think the game would be better if it removed every trace of the old system to flourish in its new identity than keep it for the sake of nostalgia and do nothing with it.

[Shouko]

Snip

Forgot to read the rest of the post...You either have to add the 2nd job to the weapons already in use or you have to create a separate set of weapon types just for that job, which is a hassle.

It doesn't matter if the toolkit is designed, what matters is the upkeep and balancing act of multiple jobs, which again they don't like to do. Gear and weapons do matter, as they have to update older weapons/armor so the 2nd job can use it or create a new weapon for every so many levels after the initial level. It's all about coding and upkeep, the minute you start having to balance multiple jobs branched off it becomes a lot more of a hassle and one way or another more jobs will be left out of raids/pvp, which already happens but to a lesser degree.

[Reynhart]

Gear and weapons do matter, as they have to update older weapons/armor so the 2nd job can use it or create a new weapon for every so many levels after the initial level.

Armor is tied to roles, most of the time. I really doubt it was that complicated to give DRK access to every 2.0 gear for WAR and PLD, AST all gear for WHM and SCH, etc...

And if you look at SCH's book, they more of less have the same stats than WHM's weapon of the same ilevel, just skinned as books. Not that difficult to create. The itemization is so straightforward in this game, I'm pretty sure you could create dozens of weapon procedurally.

[Shouko]

Armor is tied to roles, most of the time. I really doubt it was that complicated to give DRK access to every 2.0 gear for WAR and PLD, AST all gear for WHM and SCH, etc...

And if you look at SCH's book, they more of less have the same stats than WHM's weapon of the same ilevel, just skinned as books. Not that difficult to create. The itemization is so straightforward in this game, I'm pretty sure you could create dozens of weapon procedurally.

I never said it was hard, complex or any of that I said it was a hassle more than likely, in any case it really doesn't matter what we think if the devs don't want to mess with it. I don't know how simple or hard it is to do all of this but they obviously have no desire to do it.