[dev1033] Ideas for a Two-Tier Class System: Jobs on Top of Weapon Specializations

[Cairdeas]

My Single Hit/AOE thread isn't very popular even though it would fix a lot of the differences between weapons people complain about. I'm sure SE would implement them differently but again mine were just ideas.

[OmegaNovaios]

My Single Hit/AOE thread isn't very popular even though it would fix a lot of the differences between weapons people complain about. I'm sure SE would implement them differently but again mine were just ideas.

Try posting it in English Forums > DISCUSSION > Battle Content as well.

[Cairdeas]

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...e-AOE)?p=45772

[Carpe]

Added to OP:

Unlocking a Title

Since so many people on the forums seem to love the idea of unlocking jobs FF Tactics style (myself included) I just wanted to show how easy/sensible it would be to do this in this system:

Instead of just having to hit some ranks in certain base weapon classes (like unlocking BLM by hitting 10 THM and 10 CON), I think a better idea would be to have a kind of threshold that has to be met, a certain number of abilities that favor that title that have to be learned. So for the same example of BLM, in order to unlock the BLM job, you would have to learn 10~15 spells/abilities that favor BLM. You could also make it more specific and say that certain specific spells/abilities that made up the "core" of BLM would have to be learned to unlock the job. For example, you would unlock BLM after learning: Fire, Blizzard, Areo, Stone, ..., Burn, Frost, Rasp, ..., Poison, Slow, Gravity, and Bio. This looks like a lot of spells but would only require leveling THM to 12 and CON to 12.

This would solve a potential "problem" of having someone level up, say, a Marauder to lvl 20 and then doing the quest to unlock BLM without having learnt any spells/abilities that actually favor the BLM title.

[Cairdeas]

Agreed. Thumbsup.

[OmegaNovaios]

Added to OP:

Unlocking a Title

Since so many people on the forums seem to love the idea of unlocking jobs FF Tactics style (myself included) I just wanted to show how easy/sensible it would be to do this in this system:

Instead of just having to hit some ranks in certain base weapon classes (like unlocking BLM by hitting 10 THM and 10 CON), I think a better idea would be to have a kind of threshold that has to be met, a certain number of abilities that favor that title that have to be learned. So for the same example of BLM, in order to unlock the BLM job, you would have to learn 10~15 spells/abilities that favor BLM. You could also make it more specific and say that certain specific spells/abilities that made up the "core" of BLM would have to be learned to unlock the job. For example, you would unlock BLM after learning: Fire, Blizzard, Areo, Stone, ..., Burn, Frost, Rasp, ..., Poison, Slow, Gravity, and Bio. This looks like a lot of spells but would only require leveling THM to 12 and CON to 12.

This would solve a potential "problem" of having someone level up, say, a Marauder to lvl 20 and then doing the quest to unlock BLM without having learnt any spells/abilities that actually favor the BLM title.

I like this idea but bad example.

CON + THM 10 just became CON + THM 12 (I mean this make sense because there are only 2 magic classes to pull from but maybe not same ranks). lol

Give an example like to unlock Red Mage you need up to Gravity from THM, up to Protect from CON and up to Red Lotus (I think that's the correct name) from GLA.

Or instead of CON + THM 10 instead CON 20 + THM 10 for WHM and THM 20 + CON 10 for BLM (but still based on some action). Doesn't change much saying CON + THM 10 unlocks BLM from CON + THM 10 unlocks BLM because of said actions other than for lore (which I like).

Also another consideration having a total rank level combination (let's go with 30 for example and I'm only familiar with FFXI jobs) to base off jobs percentage wise.

Sorry about WHM and BLM examples because CON gets the core of both in spells and THM gets white and black magic affinities.

RDM is a little white magic, a little black magic, and melee with a sword (mostly) to some extent.
So GLA 10, CON 10, THM 10.

SCH is basically RDM with a little more white and black magic in exchange for no melee concept.
So CON 15, THM 15.

WHM is all healing and buffs a good variety of debuffs, with a minimum of DPS spells. All white magic.
So CON 20, THM 10.

BLM is all nukes and DoTs with a fair variety of debuffs, and a minimum of buffs and healing (Drain). All black magic.
So CON 24, THM 6 since this gets tier 2 nukes and DoTs or THM 20, CON 10 (since this gets Siphon MP and balances out unlocking WHM more fairly)

The mages are harder to balance this way because there are only 2 mage classes to pool from.

I had to base WHM and BLM off your idea because white magic and black magic aren't defined so much. But RDM and SCH was much easier and felt percentage based to me rather than action based. Again I have FF experience in only FF X, X-2, XI, XIII, and XIV so only XI offered me concepts for jobs/title names. SE can choose whatever name or job they previous had before in previous FF titles.

I just feel this is an alternative for those jobs/classes that would have actions only available across multiple classes at much higher end ranks and I feel all rank totals should be the same.

[Anathiel]

I have a question about red mage (multi weapon users but they weren't specialists in any weapon) in this system, if I used a rdm title with gladiator class would my sword abilities be 100% effective? Making me a "melee" red mage? Then switching my class to conj means my sword takes a hit but now I'm curing at 100%? That's what I'm understanding from the OP. But the big deal about red mage was that its never really been a 100% effective job at anything. I suppose balancing issues would be adressed by dev's, but yeah that's my thoughts.

I guess to me only certain title/class combos should have a true 100% effectiveness in any given ability. Pld/gld should be a true 100 for shield for instance, and whm/conj for cure.

This is probably the greatest thread on the forums about class changes. I really hope this one gets looked at.

[Naqaj]

Having a heal spell at 100% efficiency isn't neccessarily the same as being 100% effective in a healer role. Your Red Mage might have one 100% Heal, but he may not have a heal-over-time spell, or a damage shield, or a poison cleanse, making him a less effective healer overall.

[Anathiel]

But unless those were title specific, the red mage could get all the spells a conj would have. Assuming I subbed conj. I really don't know how well this system would be great for most jobs but I'm sorta wondering how they would implement it in game.

[Cairdeas]

You wouldn't be using a sword if you switched to conjurer so your sword abilities that you had equipped would be operating at a detriment.