Monk 4.2 Adjustments

[Neela]

their many DOTs and with their pet, they are one of the least impacted jobs when it comes to mechanics,

uhm... many dots? smn lost his 3rd dot, his dot extension with con, the ability to spam and replace shadowflare, bane got a targetdropdown, bio+mia lost pot several times... – our dots aren't anything special nowadays compared to Brd who's dot uptime is even easier or Sam dot who lasts a whole minute... smn might be on a super sayajin level right now but not because our DoTs are so awesome... there are other dots which are way better to handle than ours... thats what I said in other threads as well its an old image that we are still the major DoT cls... something they took away from our identity as well playing around with this burst-bullshit ^^'

[Kaimishi]

He doesn't know smn nor any other caster class. Forget about this dude, he doesn't know what he is talking about. His statements make no sense. Smn have to minimize the use of r2 to do decent dps. DWT mobility isn't relevant since it has to be used on strict timers, it's rather a tool to make us able to use our ogcd without clipping or forcing r2. Also we can't move during bahamut in order proc WW. He thinks our dps is granted by dots and pet, which is again a false statement. We've, as any other class, to keep gcd uptime close to 100% to make our rotation go through and do decent dps. Don't take that dude seriously, he's way off and probably won't understand these explanations anyway.

[Kaimishi]

He doesn't know smn nor any other caster class. Forget about this dude, he doesn't know what he is talking about. His statements make no sense. Smn have to minimize the use of r2 to do decent dps. DWT mobility isn't relevant since it has to be used on strict timers, it's rather a tool to make us able to use our ogcd without clipping or forcing r2. Also we can't move during bahamut in order proc WW. He thinks our dps is granted by dots and pet, which is again a false statement. We've, as any other class, to keep gcd uptime close to 100% to make our rotation go through and do decent dps. Don't take that dude seriously, he's way off and probably won't understand these explanations anyway.

[Shiroe]

and for the optimal dps, smn need pets on obey too (which aint easy with Q-ing the pet moves...; and ps4 player can practically forget obey, with the limited buttons)

[Mahrze]

uhm... many dots?

He doesn't know smn nor any other caster class.

and for the optimal dps, smn need pets on obey too (which aint easy with Q-ing the pet moves...; and ps4 player can practically forget obey, with the limited buttons)

So then can we drop the he said/she said thing of MNK vs SMN. Different roles, different weights and obviously everyone is salty about changes in 4.2.

This whole SMN /MNK thing came up because Shiroe tried to make an analogy of SMN/MNK being the 2nd best DPS due to Utility they have vs BLM/SAM being the "pure dps".

You can insist on the different values but again as mentioned before, Brotherhood only affects physical attacks and party compositions right now prefer physical attackers. Devotion benefits don't discriminate and it brings benefits in all directions. And both have the same cool down according to the official job guide website.

And No, PB doesn't change anything in terms of damage, very niche situations are available for our very niche toolkit when you compare the usability across the board that SMNs toolkit provides.

In short, MNK=/=SMN. Savvy?

[Megguido]

and for the optimal dps, smn need pets on obey too (which aint easy with Q-ing the pet moves...; and ps4 player can practically forget obey, with the limited buttons)

Summoners mostly use Ifrit, since it's very unlikely to see two casters in a comp (Ifrit gives physical vuln. whereas Garuda gives a magic vuln.). And Ifrit can pretty much stay in Sic mode with close to no DPS loss. So, I don't think PS4 players have more troubles with pets than PC players.

[Neela]

Summoners mostly use Ifrit, since it's very unlikely to see two casters in a comp (Ifrit gives physical vuln. whereas Garuda gives a magic vuln.). And Ifrit can pretty much stay in Sic mode with close to no DPS loss. So, I don't think PS4 players have more troubles with pets than PC players.

uhm... lately you face way more caster pfs than melee pfs... also just using ifrit on sic is what wtjs do who actually either don't wanna mess with micromanage or didn't know when to switch... if you really wanna call yourself smn by heart you either use ruda on obey to line up con with your (caster-pf) mates or even better (but also rare, haven't seen someone doing it in pf-grps for a while) you use both egis and their buffs in the same fight depending on the situation/mechanic - since casttime and mp allow you to switch them midfight/during or before the opener.

can't stand fakenews sry... Shiroe is right pets on obey always > sic. talking about only using sicfrit clearly shows who jumped on the 4.1 train just for fame and who didnt...

[Shiroe]

mnk & smn ARE supposed to have the 2nd highest Dps with their kind of utility.., not the "high" utility you see brd/mch, nin/drg or rdm have, .. but still utility, unlike Sam & Blm with none (or almost none, slashing)

smn & mnk SHOULD be on a similar level, dps-wise and utility wise.. (sure, smn rez is still strong, but mnk can contribute more group dps; smn should be leaning more to the prog meta, but still have high dps to be a slight speedkill meta contender; while mnk maybe leaning more towards the speedkill meta, but with mantra still a slight prog contender, even if before 4.2, mnk was more prog)

now mnk is in the "smn pre 4.2" spot, will have high (fflogs) dps wnd probably be a good contender for both prog and speedkill..

mnk did deserve some more attention, since nin and drg were still dominating the melee comp scene (and sam dominated the fflogs personal dps scene), .. just seems, like smn before 4.2, mnk will become overdominant, ...maybe every class should shine onece per patch..

see a 4.25 or 4.3 mnk nerf coming (or buff for others)

BUT the speedkill meta already has 2 MELEE and 2 PHYSICLA RANGED, with one ranged atleast exchangeable with one caster (smn pre 4.2), NOW 4.2 that meta becomes 3x MELEE.

(maybe because the prog has 1x CASTER (rdm) and smn still usefull too, SE thinks speedkill = physical / melee.., and prog = more magical / 2x casters???)

2x caster for prog might be nice, but 2x caster are not part of the prog meta, and hell not part of any speedkill.., and mnk probably just got a better spot in the prog too;... meaning casters are the lost dps class, again (!) ... after having smn shine shortly in pre 4.2 (shined too much maybe)

mnk now has a chance to shine, but its on cost of the casters, that dont have a easy time (mnk should shine on costs of a classes already long in the meta (!), not on casters costs..., or just be balanced better, but 4.2 will break the balance)

[Neela]

well its mnks expansion so we might forgive se for overtuning them this tier... like drg got a noticeable push with HW (or shortly after)... Im just wondering how op one of the caster cls will be... if they ever make a story tier based on a caster cls... q.q

[Kaimishi]

It makes sense to me that monk would have the dps if we can legit assume mantra = raise. It could because those are both very strong abilites. Now if you make BT impacts magical damage to increase your rdps, it means you indirectly buff the casters/smn aswell. It would definitely put mnk in a very strong spot and boost casters at the same time.

Note : my last post was again a response to wereotter which claims again that smn should be tuned down to RDM. It has nothing to do with smn vs mnk.