This is why this game should'nt get a parse

[Kakiko]

*snip*

Then, I'm in the minority. I get that you want parties that can clear and where everyone pulls their weight. I just take issue with the generalization that because someone doesn't have FFLogs means that person is looking for a carry. It's not true 100% of the time. I don't know, I guess it's just different expectations from the game. To me, it sounds extremely elitist that someone has to have a third party item as "proof" or they "deserve" a blacklist.

[PArcher]

Then, I'm in the minority. I get that you want parties that can clear and where everyone pulls their weight. I just take issue with the generalization that because someone doesn't have FFLogs means that person is looking for a carry. It's not true 100% of the time. I don't know, I guess it's just different expectations from the game. To me, it sounds extremely elitist that someone has to have a third party item as "proof" or they "deserve" a blacklist.

There is nothing elitist for expecting people joining a farm party to be able to pull their weight. Being able to check that someone can perform at a basic competency saves time and makes things more efficient.

EDIT: And yes, if you join a farm looking to be carried, you do deserve the kick and blacklist (especially if you haven't cleared yet). Its disrespectful to those who have put in the time and effort to get things on farm and they can definitely take steps to avoid having to deal with a player like that.

[Kakiko]

There is nothing elitist for expecting people joining a farm party to be able to pull their weight. Being able to check that someone can perform at a basic competency saves time and makes things more efficient.

I don't disagree that having people in a farm party who can pull their weight and competently complete the content isn't elitist. That wasn't even what I was calling elitist in my post you quoted. However, my counter to you would then be: why not join a static, or an fc, or a group of friends and farm, rather than rely on PF which can bring you people you find less desirable and not up to your standards (standards which are subjective to every player).

[Jijifli]

I don't disagree that having people in a farm party who can pull their weight and competently complete the content isn't elitist. That wasn't even what I was calling elitist in my post you quoted. However, my counter to you would then be: why not join a static, or an fc, or a group of friends and farm, rather than rely on PF which can bring you people you find less desirable and not up to your standards (standards which are subjective to every player).

Because there aren't 7 people in my FC that are on who want to go farm it.

Because I don't have 7 friends on that want to go out and farm it.

Maybe the static isn't on for the farm because it's not schedule'd.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

Then, I'm in the minority. I get that you want parties that can clear and where everyone pulls their weight. I just take issue with the generalization that because someone doesn't have FFLogs means that person is looking for a carry. It's not true 100% of the time. I don't know, I guess it's just different expectations from the game. To me, it sounds extremely elitist that someone has to have a third party item as "proof" or they "deserve" a blacklist.

I'll bluntly state, I typically check everyone's logs who join a farm party I've involved with for no other reason than to gauge my expectations. The less experience, the less likely I'll stay beyond a handful of attempts because I just don't believe enough players have the skill to clear. When I plan to farm something like Shinryu EX, I'm looking for fast and efficient runs, not multiple wipes to silly mistakes. Why? Because unless I get lucky, I'll be doing this for a minimum of 99 times. Now exceptions can be made. If the group has a good atmosphere and makes the attempts humorous, I may stick around longer even if it's less productive. I don't simply look at FFlogs, see a bunch of green and grey and immediately think you're trash. I just like knowing what I'm getting into, especially if I'm on tank or healer. A weaker co-tank means I may have to adjust my playstyle. Likewise, on healer, I am very aggressive and like having a general idea of what my co-healer can handle. If they have grey parses, I'm going to be far more DPS oriented to make up for their lack of damage. On the other hand, if their HPS is equally low, or they tend to DPS only, I know to put myself in the "healer" role.

Basically, FFlogs gives me a buffer instead of adjusting while completely blind. If you hide your logs, sorry, but I will assume you have something to hide. That may not be the case, however many people I've come across do so to hide poor performance.

it's still there in the log with no explanation of why my numbers were terrible or why maybe my rotation was shoddy.

Like Hoodrat mentioned, FFlogs provides that context if you know how to use it properly. I can deduce exactly how you died, what killed you and why. Right up to if it was someone else's mistake that snowballed.