Open world PvP Zone

[Kisagami]

Where do you see the fairness in eight players being able to party up together and target one lone player who wouldn't be able to get away to a "safe zone" due to how this game works with stuns, pulls, etc.? Especially when said lone player is only in the zone to do the Beast Tribe quests and such? Or how about needing to get X amount of kills for a reward, but you're on the lesser faction with no hope of doing so?

When you bring factions into PvP, it creates bullying. This is true even in Frontlines. Or do I really need to bring up every instance of Adders and Flames ganging up on Maelstrom?

THIS. People would wanna be there just for the Beast Tribe quests and fates and we wouldn’t be able to because of gankers.

[Geryth]

THIS. People would wanna be there just for the Beast Tribe quests and fates and we wouldn’t be able to because of gankers.

But that's...the purpose of open world PvP. If you don't want to get ganked doing a FATE or a Beast Tribe quest or whatever FFXIV might put into an open world zone then...don't go there.

Some people may not like end game raiding. Maybe it's the pressure of performing well or being forced to be on at certain times to push new content, or what have you. You complaining about open world PvP would be like someone who doesn't like end game raiding saying, "I hate being held to a schedule and being forced to cooperate with other players". To which the rightful reply is, "That's the price of the content that you have to pay if you want to participate".

And guess what? Lots of people opt out of lots of FFXIV content. Whether it's end-game, beast tribes, crafting, sight logs, housing etc. etc.

[Shirolumi]

When you bring factions into PvP, it creates bullying. This is true even in Frontlines. Or do I really need to bring up every instance of Adders and Flames ganging up on Maelstrom?.

I'm not sure if I understand this. How are you supposed to PvP if you're not part of different factions. Or are you saying it should be a free-for-all deathmatch in the area? Every man for himself? It could work I guess, but unless there is partying up available to form teams, that wouldn't be much fun. This is what competitive stuff is. Again, let us just take a look at sports. If two people from one football team is running to get the ball from a lone player, are they bullying him? No. That's just how the game works.

In Frontlines, if let's say Mael is in the lead and Twin and Flames both attack them, that is not bullying. That else are they supposed to do there? Just sit back, fight each other and let Mael win?

I'd very much like to know your logic behind this.

THIS. People would wanna be there just for the Beast Tribe quests and fates and we wouldn’t be able to because of gankers.

It seems people got stuck on the idea of Beast Tribes in the area. If we just remove Beast Tribe quest then, would there be any objections to a open-world pvp zone? Because if you don't like PvP, now there wouldn't be any reason to go there. It would be just for PvPers.

[Kisagami]

It seems people got stuck on the idea of Beast Tribes in the area. If we just remove Beast Tribe quest then, would there be any objections to a open-world pvp zone? Because if you don't like PvP, now there wouldn't be any reason to go there. It would be just for PvPers.

I can only get behind this unless there is no storyline plot part of the area. If it is just PVP, I’m good, as I won’t feel the need to go there ever. Storyline needs to be kept PVE.

[Zandeth]

I'd very much like to know your logic behind this.

The Frontlines example does not always apply when a company is in the lead. Many, many times I have experienced a GC being ganged up on while in last place for "farming" purposes. It's very frustrating when you're on the company being double-teamed, but at the same time when you're on one of the two doing it, you don't really care how they feel. Because who doesn't jump at the chance to pick on an easy mark for easy points? Also if we were to use football as a comparison, an open world PvP zone would be equal to someone grabbing the ball and running, only to get tackled by someone who was in the stands. Comparing anything open world with sports doesn't work. If you want to actually compare FFXIV's PvP with Football: the Feast. The Feast is also how you PvP without worrying about factions, so that's how you're supposed to PvP.

[Shirolumi]

...

If it's not the company in the lead, that is just one losing team being stupid because those points are never going to amount to a win if the leading team is also farming. They are not bullying together. It's the winning team taking advantage of the bad team basically.
How would it be like that? Every player entering the zone knows its purpose, just like with queueing for FL or Feast. Maybe I worded myself badly, but when I say factions, I mean that entirely as something that could be tied to a story. I clearly state in the OP, 2 factions (or maybe more). That would be 2 teams. The Feast is 2 teams too. The Feast is competitive PvP. I am suggesting this to be something else.

Because people get toxic. Competition in gaming is not sportsmanlike. Look at Overwatch. Look at WOW. I want a relaxing sense of community where people aren’t screaming about banging my mother or threatening me in real life just because I may have killed them. .

I am sorry but there are so many things that I disagree with in this post.
1. "Because people get toxic". If you think that, I'm guessing you're against all type of PvP in this game. But then again what are you then doing on the PvP forum? I don't raid much, it's not like I go to the raid forums to complain about people getting ultimate.
2. "I want a relaxing sense of community where I don't want people screaming at the for wiping them in PvE content". Guess what, that happens to ALOT of people. So that argument is invalid as it doesn't apply to only pvp.
3. "You’re working together in PVE content; it breeds being kind to each other." There are toxic players in PvE too. Tons of examples of this on the official forums, reddit, etc.
4. With the way FFXIV works, you'd probably not be able to spawnkill anything considering we always rez in sanctuaries, where as I said in the OP, is a safe zone.
5. No it's not only fun if you harass people. I am part of an active PvP LS on Tonberry. We only have players that wants to help each other, we cheer at eac hother and encourage everyone to try to climb in the feast. We feel sorry for each other having a bad match, if we rank down. We learn from one another and most of all, we don't promote bad mannering or harassment. If someone is a real a-hole, they are not welcome.

I don't think one area would bring those people at all. People who don't come to FFXIVs PvP, don't come here cause they think it sucks. An area wouldn't change that. But for those who play it, and love it (or just stick with it), I think we would really love a place like this. You can't say they shouldn't do anything just because you don't want to. It's not your game only. For example: Do you like glams? I don't. I think it's annoying when people run around in pretty outfits. Get those out of my MMO. Don't add any more glams because that would only bring in RPers and casuals. FULL DISCLOSURE: I DON'T ACTUALLY FEEL LIKE THIS. That was just an example. But do you see how selfish that sounds?

If you don't like PvP, you're more than welcome to say that in this thread, but don't continue to argue why we who love PvP shouldn't have more PvP stuff to do just because you don't like it. If you don't like it, fine. Don't actively try to prevent others from getting what they like.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

THIS. People would wanna be there just for the Beast Tribe quests and fates and we wouldn’t be able to because of gankers.

It's worth noting that they likely wouldn't put any "necessary" PvE content in an area designed for PvP. People want it so separated, so it likely would be. That said, if anyone stepped in without the intent to PvP, they would likely have ignored any notifications that it's a PvP area and would thus be responsible for themselves in that regard. Might sound cruel to say that, but then I think it's selfish that someone's PvE-centric reason to step into a PvP area should hold more precedence. Would you not agree?

I can only get behind this unless there is no storyline plot part of the area. If it is just PVP, I’m good, as I won’t feel the need to go there ever. Storyline needs to be kept PVE.

And why is that? Because people insist on the limited idea that "this is a PvE game"? Even Yoshi P has wanted to utilize PvP in a main scenario instance before (yet noted the players' general reactions to PvP being reason why he wouldn't). Way to hold the game back. . . And yet, the Nadaam, which so many loved and enjoyed is LITERALLY Seal Rock (Seize) with one objective instead of many.

Why do people act like it'd be so horrible to play against someone in a multiplayer game? Don't say it's cause of the battle system; it was a hell of a lot better back when people didn't want to try it. Story? People fight each other in the story. Eorzea is not a perfect utopia. Grand Companies train against each other both for the sake of a land dispute, and as joint training exercises (that is EXACTLY the Frontlines lore). The Warrior of Light isn't a pacifist. You've hurt and killed people. People have hurt and tried to kill you. It's part of your life as an adventurer. Why then is it suddenly so different, so taboo when it's another person who plays the game?

[Kisagami]

Why do people act like it'd be so horrible to play against someone in a multiplayer game? Don't say it's cause of the battle system; it was a hell of a lot better back when people didn't want to try it. Story? People fight each other in the story.

Because people get toxic. Competition in gaming is not sportsmanlike. Look at Overwatch. Look at WOW. I want a relaxing sense of community where people aren’t screaming about banging my mother or threatening me in real life just because I may have killed them. I hate having storyline interrupted by the selfishness or others who just want cheap kills by camping areas people rez in. It is a cycle of behavior that ruins the relaxing atmosphere of FF14. You’re working together in PVE content; it breeds being kind to each other. As you’re held accountable to your behavior; bad behavor, nobody dungeons with you. In PVP those ideals go out the window - it’s only “fun” if you hunt and harass people.

TL;DR Add an open PVP area, here comes the bad actors from WoW, Archeage, Destiny, and Overwatch. It wouldn’t be your kind of PVPers you claim you are in FF14. Here come the people who love to ruin other’s fun.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

Because people get toxic. Competition in gaming is not sportsmanlike. Look at Overwatch. Look at WOW. I want a relaxing sense of community where people aren’t screaming about banging my mother or threatening me in real life just because I may have killed them. I hate having storyline interrupted by the selfishness or others who just want cheap kills by camping areas people rez in. It is a cycle of behavior that ruins the relaxing atmosphere of FF14. You’re working together in PVE content; it breeds being kind to each other. As you’re held accountable to your behavior; bad behavor, nobody dungeons with you. In PVP those ideals go out the window - it’s only “fun” if you hunt and harass people.

TL;DR Add an open PVP area, here comes the bad actors from WoW, Archeage, Destiny, and Overwatch. It wouldn’t be your kind of PVPers you claim you are in FF14. Here come the people who love to ruin other’s fun.

There's a lot of things I would contest in your statement.

Let's not act like people don't bicker and argue over hunts. Let's not act like all was fair and peaceful with the Shirogane housing rush. Or in dungeons or alliance raids when people are impatient or repeatedly perform wrong. Let's not act like people don't perform wrong on purpose just to upset others. Let's not act like people don't steal from FCs or maliciously undercut others on the market board. Let's not act like people don't judge and berate others for parses, despite the taboo of even parsing in the first place.

Bad behavior is not unique nor exclusive to PvP, and it's time to stop treating it like it is, or that it's a source of it. If that were the case, the above wouldn't happen so frequently, in content that has absolutely nothing to do with competition in the first place. It IS possible to be sportsmanlike in competitive gaming. Professionals do exactly that, and even then, it's not an exclusive right and privilege for them. We're all adults here, no one should NEED to be told to behave themselves and not act like a jerk, and yet many do, and without ever stepping foot in PvP. So it's not the grand source of toxicity people would make it out to be. And it goes without saying that because people like that exist, there are rules. There are ToS and reporting systems. But again, we're all adults. Behaving shouldn't be something most people need to learn to do the hard way.

Only fun if you hunt and harass people? Maybe for someone who just has that kind of ill temperament. Speaking only for myself, I enjoy PvP more when there's active, fierce competition. Sure, tempers might flare, passions might burn really hot, but nothing is more thrilling than a competition where both sides are giving 100%. The fun IS the competition. Do you know what comes out of that, more often than not in this game? People acknowledge each others' skills. It makes them want to work together. They become friends. Maybe you've had some bad experiences that have soured you, and that's truly unfortunate. But as an avid Destiny and Overwatch player as well, I can easily enjoy a heated match and go all out against someone, and assuming they're not just a nasty person with a bad attitude, I can enjoy it without treating it as some fun-ruining event that defines competitive gaming for me.

Mileage may vary from person to person, but don't fault competitive gaming/competitive modes/maps for the actions of negative people. The examples I gave show they'll be just as nasty even without competition involved.

[Kisama]

I want a relaxing sense of community where people aren’t screaming about banging my mother or threatening me in real life just because I may have killed them.

"I don't want pvp so it shouldn't be a feature for anybody." Such entitlement.