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  1. #1
    Player
    Kisagami's Avatar
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    Sep 2013
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    Gridania
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    309
    Character
    Taisynn Arghal
    World
    Siren
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    Summoner Lv 61
    There are a lot of contradicting viewpoints and suggestions here. My alarm was OP’s suggestion of adding beast tribes and fates. Which, in other games with open world PVP, is just bait to get PvE players to come out so they can get ganked. In the world of MMOs, there is already a set negative connotation with PVP. I came to FF14 to avoid those PVPers. I would quit if Square Enix changed the atmosphere or feel. I like our current community, and those who just like stories like from single player games, it’s an allure that makes them want to get their feet wet in an MMO. To avoid super competition and just play co-op woth friends. We got enough dog eat dog in this world. Fantasy is an escape from the real world.

    Final Fantasy 14 is not an Open World Sandbox like Archeage where the story is kind of an afterthought and PVP is the focus. FF14 is focused on story and PVE content, and PVP is the afterthought. It is extra things to do. This is what people are worried about. Suddenly adding an open world PVP zone could change the dynamics of the game community; people don’t want to attract the bad actors of other games. Their concerns are just as valid as yours. You’re getting angry because our compromises aren’t enough for you. The pount we’re making here: Ff14 is different than other games with a mostly positive community and we wanna keep it that way.

    Literally, the majority of people here are just wanting you to understand we don’t like having to be paranoid that we’re talking to an NPC or looking at a map and suddenly here comes 8 people on a war path just because they can. You all gave these ideas and contradicting viewpoints and now you set the stage for misunderstanding.

    My compromise is keep PVE out of it, dedicate it solely to PVP, and we’re good. I’m not gonna budge or discard anyone else’s opinion, nor am I gonna demand anyone else to agree with it. I’m above personal attacks for different opinions.
    (2)
    Last edited by Kisagami; 11-17-2017 at 10:38 AM. Reason: Clarity of Point
    Taisynn Arghal of Siren
    FC Leader of Cult of the Chocobo (18+), LGBT-Friendly Guild
    Quote Originally Posted by Kisagami View Post
    We’re all advocating for the type of game we want to see. Mine just happens to clash with yours. I like a story driven game, where people can come together as a community, and defeat challenges based on a PVE format. I want to work together. [snip] You’re not gonna like what I say, but I’m gonna say it regardless because I want Square Enix to hear the other side.

  2. #2
    Player
    Shirolumi's Avatar
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    Oct 2016
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    Ul'dah
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    Character
    Nova Phantom
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Kisagami View Post
    There are a lot of contradicting viewpoints and suggestions here.
    The Beast Tribes and Fates were just an idea. I can understand not wanting to read every reply in the thread, but as the thread went on I suggested things like either removing them and focusing solely on PvP, or to be able to have a PvP toggle so that PvEers could do them (for whatever reason, even though they are PvP centric). That's why it may seem contradictory, but it's because as the thread went on... all of us who wants these things try to compromise for PvErs who enter the thread and said they don't want that basically.

    Also, I'd be fine if it was instanced as Diadem... as long as you could enter it whenever you wanted and not have to wait for people. Let me queue for it alone and people can join the fight during those 2-3 hours the instance is up or something.
    (0)
    Last edited by Shirolumi; 11-17-2017 at 12:31 PM.

  3. #3
    Player
    Kisagami's Avatar
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    Gridania
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    Character
    Taisynn Arghal
    World
    Siren
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    Summoner Lv 61
    I really like WinterSandman’s idea. PVP Centeic options for all classes, including gatherers, that must be toggled. It would be like Corsairs Stronghold from Tera - capture the forts and resources kind of thing. I approve. Actually, I enjoyed The Elder Scroll Online’s optional PVP areas, except for the fact they actually did have gankers in the PVE content. But the place was so large and instanced, I could easily hide or avoid the main groups. I actually did participate in the capture the fort side of it on weekends. Was fun.
    (2)
    Last edited by Kisagami; 11-17-2017 at 11:06 AM.
    Taisynn Arghal of Siren
    FC Leader of Cult of the Chocobo (18+), LGBT-Friendly Guild
    Quote Originally Posted by Kisagami View Post
    We’re all advocating for the type of game we want to see. Mine just happens to clash with yours. I like a story driven game, where people can come together as a community, and defeat challenges based on a PVE format. I want to work together. [snip] You’re not gonna like what I say, but I’m gonna say it regardless because I want Square Enix to hear the other side.

  4. #4
    Player
    Kisagami's Avatar
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    Sep 2013
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    Gridania
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    Taisynn Arghal
    World
    Siren
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    Summoner Lv 61
    Just Saying: I love Wolf’s Den and I have been adamant against the open world concept of PVP with PVE content inside of it. Alien Gamer’s agrument is entirely valid in my opinion.
    (1)
    Taisynn Arghal of Siren
    FC Leader of Cult of the Chocobo (18+), LGBT-Friendly Guild
    Quote Originally Posted by Kisagami View Post
    We’re all advocating for the type of game we want to see. Mine just happens to clash with yours. I like a story driven game, where people can come together as a community, and defeat challenges based on a PVE format. I want to work together. [snip] You’re not gonna like what I say, but I’m gonna say it regardless because I want Square Enix to hear the other side.

  5. #5
    Player
    Shouko's Avatar
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    Aliiza Duskryn
    World
    Jenova
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    Weaver Lv 52
    Why do people feel the need to add pvp into everything that's not meant to be pvp? There a lot of games out there specifically are built around pvp, why insist on adding it into games that are primarily pve focused?
    (4)

  6. #6
    Player
    Mofafafa's Avatar
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    Dec 2014
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    Mocha Fafa
    World
    Tonberry
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    Botanist Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Shouko View Post
    Why do people feel the need to add pvp into everything that's not meant to be pvp? There a lot of games out there specifically are built around pvp, why insist on adding it into games that are primarily pve focused?
    Yes, you're right, ff14 is PvE focused game. Just like Diadem is so PvE centric that allow everyone to enjoy playing it.

    such huge resources pour into it and everyone loves it
    (1)

  7. #7
    Player
    ThirdChild_ZKI's Avatar
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    Jan 2014
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    Lace Valeria
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Shouko View Post
    Why do people feel the need to add pvp into everything that's not meant to be pvp? There a lot of games out there specifically are built around pvp, why insist on adding it into games that are primarily pve focused?
    The same question can be asked in reverse. Why are people so adverse to PvP in a game that already has it because there was enough player demand for it, and in no way enforces it on anyone? Yoshi P noted that the game simply isn't built for it currently. Hunts, FATEs, gathering, there's too much open world content that would be impacted with a system like that, but he's reasonable enough to consider creating PvP servers if players wished it.


    That said, people here are simply asking for a zone. A ZONE. New, or reused. Hell, they could just add onto the Wolves Den Pier, as it's clearly connected to a nearby landmass. People have suggested and recommended almost every possible accomodation so that non-PvPers neither have to go anywhere near it, nor miss out on anything PvE-related for not wanting to go near/through it. PvPers are the ones trying to compromise here, but at least get a little more than a 90/10 split. So where's the issue? That is, where's the issue beyond wishy-washy entitlements and two-dimensional opinions?

    It's fine if you don't like PvP. NOTHING in this game forces it on you. Nothing save for the rewards exclusive to PvP is missed by not doing it. And as I said before, you don't HAVE to have everything. Certainly not PvP rewards if you dislike PvP. I don't like hunts. I LOVE tigers, and I really wanted that tiger mount, but I don't like hunts enough to make myself do them. And that's fine. Hunts aren't forced on me in any way, and for that reason, I have no issue with them being in game. I'll even call them out for the ones that do enjoy it, or do my part to help if I'm in a party that wants to go after one. But reverse that and have me asking that same party to participate in one PvP instance, and you'd think I asked them to go commit a crime.

    PvPers aren't asking for a total overhaul of FFXIV. They're asking for a little more. That's all we've ever asked for. Yet it's unacceptable in some people's eyes. Or worse, you have people who legitimately think PvP takes away from resources for more PvE content. Updates for PvP are so scarce, that's ridiculous to think. Just using Frontlines for example, major updates to it were 2.3 (when it was added), 3.05, 3.3, and now finally something new and different from it in 4.15. Everything else has been regular PvE updates, including within those same patches. Some things were even delayed, but tell me how PvP had anything to do with that in those cases?

    I can't stress enough that wanting to "keep PvP out of my MMOs" is a pretty terrible mindset, especially in a game where it already gets so little support from both devs and players. . . But a playerbase DOES exist for it, and all they want is a little more they can enjoy, and not even in a way that impacts others or forces them to have to bother with it. What's so wrong with that?
    (0)

  8. #8
    Player
    Shouko's Avatar
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    Sep 2013
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    Aliiza Duskryn
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    Jenova
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    Weaver Lv 52
    This game isn't set up for PvP was we've already established, so how long is one new zone appease you until you get bored of it and want something new yet again? The reason I say that you should go to a game designed around PvP for PvP is so you can do it to your hearts content, something like Overwatch is more akin to PvP like this game but oriented towards PvP in general. It has plenty of characters to choose from it's action packed, it's constantly updating maps and characters to add in for PvP.

    I'm not going to throw a fit or rage if it does happen, i'm merely making conversation and asking why people want it so badly in a non PvP oriented game.
    (1)

  9. #9
    Player
    ThirdChild_ZKI's Avatar
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    Jan 2014
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    Lace Valeria
    World
    Jenova
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    Machinist Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Shouko View Post
    This game isn't set up for PvP
    And yet they made it, and made it work before. In fact, the old system was a lot more balanced than the new system we have. Problem is people were so convinced PvP was bad, or the players were toxic, or that the system wasn't designed for PvP that they just accepted that idea without trying it themselves. Please be familiar with this before making such a statement.

    And while I'm on the subject of erroneous statements, let me point something out: This game is "meant to be" whatever players want it to be. You wanted housing? They added housing. You wanted a marriage system, they added the Eternal Bond. You wanted a vanity system, you got Glamours. We wanted PvP, and they delivered. It's not perfect; it was never perfect, but neither was much of the PvE content initially either. To try to imply that the game "isn't meant for PvP" is limited thinking, and quite detrimental to the growth and prosperity of a multiplayer online game. Imagine if the devs thought that way with regards to the above mentioned additions? Ask yourself this before you declare what the game is "meant" for.
    (3)

  10. #10
    Player
    Shirolumi's Avatar
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    Oct 2016
    Location
    Ul'dah
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    154
    Character
    Nova Phantom
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Shouko View Post
    This game isn't set up for PvP was we've already established, so how long is one new zone appease you until you get bored of it and want something new yet again? The reason I say that you should go to a game designed around PvP for PvP is so you can do it to your hearts content, something like Overwatch is more akin to PvP like this game but oriented towards PvP in general. It has plenty of characters to choose from it's action packed, it's constantly updating maps and characters to add in for PvP.

    I'm not going to throw a fit or rage if it does happen, i'm merely making conversation and asking why people want it so badly in a non PvP oriented game.
    The thing is, that argument doesn't work. Plenty of people mention it in this thread. But I hate Overwatch. Not interested in it at all. I love this game. I want PvP in this game. Why can't you go and play some other PvE oriented game instead?

    And of course we are going to want more after awhile. Maybe not a new zone, but a new mode or something. Am I not allowed to want that? Why are you allowed to want something more for PvE?

    And this game is set up for PvP, we have it and there are people who enjoy it a lot. Just because it isn't as good in some peoples eye as PvP in other games, doesn't mean its not meant for this game or set up for it. Because if it was like you said, we wouldn't have PvP in the game.
    (1)

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