Open world PvP Zone

[Geryth]

Open World PvP is almost always a one-sided bullying fest. And none of these ideas would make it better.

Some of the most gaming fun I've ever had was getting revenge on someone or a group of people who thought they'd gank around. Calling open world PvP "almost always" a one-sided bully fest is your anecdotal experience, and might indicate your actual experience with it isn't much.

You must not have ever tasted the glory of downing an open world boss in the midst of a PvP fight over it before. You're missing out.

[Zandeth]

fluff

So you're countering my "anecdotal experience" with your own and trying to assume you know what I've experienced personally, interesting. Tell me then, where do you see the fairness in eight players being able to party up together and target one lone player who wouldn't be able to get away to a "safe zone" due to how this game works with stuns, pulls, etc.? Especially when said lone player is only in the zone to do the Beast Tribe quests and such? Or how about needing to get X amount of kills for a reward, but you're on the lesser faction with no hope of doing so?

When you bring factions into PvP, it creates bullying. This is true even in Frontlines. Or do I really need to bring up every instance of Adders and Flames ganging up on Maelstrom?

I am speaking from experience because that is how a proper opinion is formed. Saying something is anecdotal is just trying to make your opinion sound better when it's just the same as my own.

[Geryth]

So you're countering my "anecdotal experience" with your own and trying to assume you know what I've experienced personally, interesting.

I'm glad you noticed, the exact purpose of my statements were to highlight how players have vastly different experiences but it doesn't mean it's applicable to the bigger picture.

Tell me then, where do you see the fairness in eight players being able to party up together and target one lone player who wouldn't be able to get away to a "safe zone" due to how this game works with stuns, pulls, etc.? Especially when said lone player is only in the zone to do the Beast Tribe quests and such? Or how about needing to get X amount of kills for a reward, but you're on the lesser faction with no hope of doing so?

When you bring factions into PvP, it creates bullying. This is true even in Frontlines. Or do I really need to bring up every instance of Adders and Flames ganging up on Maelstrom?

Those are rules and scenarios of open world PvP that you accept when you attempt the content. My entire WoW career was on a PvP server and I fell victim to open world PvP messing up my mundane solo goals many times. It's quite easy to deal with - you get some buddies to get revenge or you leave and do something else. If that bothers you, then open world PvP isn't your thing and that's perfectly fine. It's optional content that you don't have to participate in.

I am speaking from experience because that is how a proper opinion is formed. Saying something is anecdotal is just trying to make your opinion sound better when it's just the same as my own.

Your anecdotal experiences are absolutely valid to bring up. An experience is an experience, and all experiences add up to something, whether yours is part of the norm or not. But you seemed to be speaking with authoritative blanket statements about what all open world PvP is like. Open world PvP can be very fun for many people, and it's worked quite well for many other games. So to say things like "it's always a bully fest" just isn't true.

[Kisagami]

Where do you see the fairness in eight players being able to party up together and target one lone player who wouldn't be able to get away to a "safe zone" due to how this game works with stuns, pulls, etc.? Especially when said lone player is only in the zone to do the Beast Tribe quests and such? Or how about needing to get X amount of kills for a reward, but you're on the lesser faction with no hope of doing so?

When you bring factions into PvP, it creates bullying. This is true even in Frontlines. Or do I really need to bring up every instance of Adders and Flames ganging up on Maelstrom?

THIS. People would wanna be there just for the Beast Tribe quests and fates and we wouldn’t be able to because of gankers.

[Geryth]

THIS. People would wanna be there just for the Beast Tribe quests and fates and we wouldn’t be able to because of gankers.

But that's...the purpose of open world PvP. If you don't want to get ganked doing a FATE or a Beast Tribe quest or whatever FFXIV might put into an open world zone then...don't go there.

Some people may not like end game raiding. Maybe it's the pressure of performing well or being forced to be on at certain times to push new content, or what have you. You complaining about open world PvP would be like someone who doesn't like end game raiding saying, "I hate being held to a schedule and being forced to cooperate with other players". To which the rightful reply is, "That's the price of the content that you have to pay if you want to participate".

And guess what? Lots of people opt out of lots of FFXIV content. Whether it's end-game, beast tribes, crafting, sight logs, housing etc. etc.

[Shirolumi]

When you bring factions into PvP, it creates bullying. This is true even in Frontlines. Or do I really need to bring up every instance of Adders and Flames ganging up on Maelstrom?.

I'm not sure if I understand this. How are you supposed to PvP if you're not part of different factions. Or are you saying it should be a free-for-all deathmatch in the area? Every man for himself? It could work I guess, but unless there is partying up available to form teams, that wouldn't be much fun. This is what competitive stuff is. Again, let us just take a look at sports. If two people from one football team is running to get the ball from a lone player, are they bullying him? No. That's just how the game works.

In Frontlines, if let's say Mael is in the lead and Twin and Flames both attack them, that is not bullying. That else are they supposed to do there? Just sit back, fight each other and let Mael win?

I'd very much like to know your logic behind this.

THIS. People would wanna be there just for the Beast Tribe quests and fates and we wouldn’t be able to because of gankers.

It seems people got stuck on the idea of Beast Tribes in the area. If we just remove Beast Tribe quest then, would there be any objections to a open-world pvp zone? Because if you don't like PvP, now there wouldn't be any reason to go there. It would be just for PvPers.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

THIS. People would wanna be there just for the Beast Tribe quests and fates and we wouldn’t be able to because of gankers.

It's worth noting that they likely wouldn't put any "necessary" PvE content in an area designed for PvP. People want it so separated, so it likely would be. That said, if anyone stepped in without the intent to PvP, they would likely have ignored any notifications that it's a PvP area and would thus be responsible for themselves in that regard. Might sound cruel to say that, but then I think it's selfish that someone's PvE-centric reason to step into a PvP area should hold more precedence. Would you not agree?

I can only get behind this unless there is no storyline plot part of the area. If it is just PVP, I’m good, as I won’t feel the need to go there ever. Storyline needs to be kept PVE.

And why is that? Because people insist on the limited idea that "this is a PvE game"? Even Yoshi P has wanted to utilize PvP in a main scenario instance before (yet noted the players' general reactions to PvP being reason why he wouldn't). Way to hold the game back. . . And yet, the Nadaam, which so many loved and enjoyed is LITERALLY Seal Rock (Seize) with one objective instead of many.

Why do people act like it'd be so horrible to play against someone in a multiplayer game? Don't say it's cause of the battle system; it was a hell of a lot better back when people didn't want to try it. Story? People fight each other in the story. Eorzea is not a perfect utopia. Grand Companies train against each other both for the sake of a land dispute, and as joint training exercises (that is EXACTLY the Frontlines lore). The Warrior of Light isn't a pacifist. You've hurt and killed people. People have hurt and tried to kill you. It's part of your life as an adventurer. Why then is it suddenly so different, so taboo when it's another person who plays the game?

[Shirolumi]

1. Rival Wings is a 1v1 factions mode.
2. No. That just promotes bullying.
3. Double no.
4. Why even? Just leave if you don't want to be attacked.
5. That seems wholly unneeded.
6. Seriously no, we don't need FATEs in PvP.
7. You don't seem to understand what Beast Tribes are to suggest that.
8. "Bully them for more bonuses."
9. Why even. Just. Stop. We have an arena, we have ways of making in-game tournaments, what even is a PvP "mini-game"?
10 and 11. "Let's all just join one faction and bully anyone who's foolish enough to join the other side." ala Cerulean Order and Crimson Legion in Blade n Soul.

Open World PvP is almost always a one-sided bullying fest. And none of these ideas would make it better.

1. Rival Wings is objective based instanced PvP that last for prob 20 minutes, not a PvP zone.
2. Isn't that the point of being in the PvP zone? To PvP... if u can't attack each other there wouldn't be a point to it.
3. Add flying then. I just suggested that because I don't know how flying would work in a PvP zone. Can you attack someone on a flying mount? Does it dismount them? Does this give ranged an advantage? Etc.
4. So that you can flee from someone, heal yourself up etc, bring someone with you and attack.
5. This is so that you don't have to change factions of whatever if you want to PvP with friends that are in different factions.
6. Why not? I'd find them fun.
7. What are Beast Tribes then? I think that a Beast Tribe that introduces several factions (not just 2 like with the other beast tribes) would be a interesting idea. They'd all have their goals and reasons, would be a fun story with new objectives, not just the same old.
8. How is this bullying? People who WANT to PvP will enter this zone.
9. I don't know what a PvP mini-game would be. We don't have a way to organize tournaments in-game right now. We have custom matches, but no in-game brackets. So that's outside of the game. Yes we have an arena in the Wolves Den. One more couldn't hurt.
10 & 11. There are ways to work around that, maybe different rewards for different factions.

[Geryth]

I would love a PvP zone. A lot of people here seem to not understand that like a lot of content in this game, it would be optional. If it's not your cup of tea, that's fine. And chime in, your voice is important. But don't bash on the idea, it's sufficient to say that it's not something you would enjoy or participate in.

But I think a PvP zone could be implemented in a way that can offer both serious and casual rewards, and act as a casual stepping stone to invite some FC friends who would be less comfortable "queuing" for PvP. A great idea with a lot of promise, if done correctly.

[Synestra]

I would love a PvP zone.

If its something like Wintergrasp but without turrets and vehicles it would be pretty damn cool, attacking/defending factories with my buddy were most memorable things i did in wotlk, damn those 2vX fights were sometimes epic as hell even if it was just stalling. Maybe its time to rework Diadem yet again eh?