Black Mage

[Llugen]

A test server that they could invite "top players" to test new jobs and give feedback before changes are set in stone would be really nice. They did that event where they invited all the YouTubers to try out the 4.0 jobs at that one expo, if they just had a test server for a cross section of the playerbase it would alleviate a HUGE amount of headache.

Developers might be able to run tests and do math, but only players who play the game consistently at a high level can really describe the "feel" of a class, and perhaps more importantly, how the synergy develops into the meta. I don't see why SE is so opposed to opening up in this vein.

[Remedi]

to be fair its still better than being stuck with DRG/NIN/BRD/MCH since 3.4

And to be fair this game has a much better balance than others in general
Or maybe I just experienced much worse in general

@Llugen: Even if they did, they'll probably recruit mostly japanese players, which will lead the community to whine about them listening only to japanese players.
Regardless to give proper feedback ppl would need to understand what is the vision behind some changes, something that not many do, only then you can express some criticism, also players need to have the integrity to actually identify some possible exploits or uintended way for the class to be played and report it. Not so sure that many are capable of that

[IllyriaKnotfred]

Lmao. What a joke. That's all the data thats needed, this is all old content, people know the fights. If summoners numbers are that high things already need to change.

[OgruMogru]

I kinda feel like losing Raging strikes is at the heart of some of the problems we're having. Every other class has something in their kit to block that gap except for BLm and on top of that we're actively discluded from one of those [embolden] which still feels like the biggest intentional fuck you. Transpose desperately needs a shorter cooldown. A 1 second window every 13 seconds is horrible to deal with on top of the additional punishment of reduced stacks and longer cast times it yields. We're forced to hobble ourselves to deal with mechanics everyone else can manage with little disruption. Would umbral hearts be more effective if instead of granting free casts it granted 3 instant fire 1's? How about that troublesome Enochian button which, in an ideal world, we would only need to use once per fight? How about we get some kind of small target's magic resist down stack with each successful enochian [as in that button, not the refreshing of astral and umbral] reapplication? Actually make that button useful again every 30 seconds instead of it just sitting there.

[Neela]

It's a slap in the face for people who decide to stick with their class and it screws the power balance up even more.

pls... this is absolutly the worst argument ever you can say facing a smn - it's always us who get fucked up with every expansion in the first place - looking over to you whos cls is always supirior because of reasons, same reasons will solve your "issues" near by. Blm never had a real bad time/spot - just relax Yoshi is comin'.

[BlackcatChen]

>Blm never had a real bad time/spot - just relax Yoshi is comin'.

BLM has been relatively weak since 3.3.

[Galvuu]

Not gonna read through it all, but I saw some talk about the Raise debate (again).
I'm not going to explain why this contradicts the job identity or the lore (and it does).

This would be a silly bandaid fix that fixes nothing.
Think where the raise has the most value- that's right, progression. It can salvage a bad pull and allow you to practice/see/figure out new mechanics. Sure, it has sporadic value if a healer dies to whatever mechanic, but usually you don't rely on dps rezing during progression (you generally won't be mana starved and it's best to have a healer do it to push phases and the like).
This is intrinsically at odds with how Black Mage functions on a fundamental level- to be executed perfectly, Black Mage requires deep knowledge of the fight and its timings and perfect cd alignment with key mechanics.
Black Mage, by design, is a bad job for progression. So if you try to fix the lack of utility with a tool for progression in a job that's naturally bad at that, you fix nothing. Why exactly aren't you taking RDM in progression?
Or better yet, the hyper mobile, infinite-mp, higher dps SMN?
You won't. You won't take them. If progression performance is a concern and you need the dps rez, you take either RDM or SMN over BLM for progression.

This job has to shine in the scenario it's designed to shine on- when you've mastered the fight.
If this is achieved by giving it synergistic offensive utility or pumping up the raw damage numbers, I don't know, but the rez is not going to cut it.

Further, I think the "selfish" dps design of SAM and BLM is quite interesting, but SE always chickens out on giving these job the actual large numbers they need (especially BLM).
Further, most buffs are now raid wide. There's a scarcity of strong, single target buffs (Dragon's Eye and... that's it now, actually). Having a few of these on top of the aoe ones would benefit this type of high single target dps job.
These jobs are pieces of artillery (especially BLM)- it's a clunky job that you point at something, so the return must be that the target explodes.
And no, single target Balance does not count, that is never ever going to outdps the raid contribution of an aoe Balance on a good party when used on a single target, neither enhanced nor extended.

pls... this is absolutly the worst argument ever you can say facing a smn - it's always us who get fucked up with every expansion in the first place - looking over to you whos cls is always supirior because of reasons, same reasons will solve your "issues" near by. Blm never had a real bad time/spot - just relax Yoshi is comin'.

I'm pretty sure SMN is really strong right now.
You (and most SMNs) might dislike how it plays, but that doesn't change the fact it's strong. You either embrace the change or... dunno.
When BLM changed in HW, there was a lot of backlash (cliunky, restrictive, too hard, not simple, tight timers). Some of those complaints were valid, but I did grow to absolutely love it. It just took time.
Or try something else, dunno. But it marginally irks me that you got a lot of attention and come here to rail on us x)

[Grimoire-M]

If BLMs ever get a raise, SE had better make it a self-only raise that automatically puts you at full HP/MP in AF3 & Enochian on a 15m cooldown, with the stipulation that if you drop Enochian again, you die. That's some selfish utility, but selfish utility is still utility, and makes them better in prog, where one of their few advantages is that they have the least punishment for death. Leylines is the only significant CD that they can lose, after all. If you lose triple-cast it needed to be popped earlier, and whatever needed it has already killed you.


Other than that, SMN needs numbers nerfs and QoL buffs. BRD/MCH need the same 5% piercing debuff DRG has (to eliminate that dependency rather than because they need damage buffs), as well as reduced emnity for self instead of halving emnity on Tactician/Refresh. BLM needs a slight dps boost to make up for their lack of utility. Melee wise NIN needs a TA nerf, DRG is fine, MNK needs Brotherhood to affect casters, and SAM is fine cause I don't know if it needs anything given the rest happens. NIN's aggro advantages add the least potency over a fight, so they are fine as is.

[GospelVhae]

https://www.fflogs.com/statistics/17...t=2&dataset=95

I called it, but this is pretty absurd actually. Guess we're actually back to the status quo that is 3.2

What a game

[Llugen]

This is intrinsically at odds with how Black Mage functions on a fundamental level- to be executed perfectly, Black Mage requires deep knowledge of the fight and its timings and perfect cd alignment with key mechanics.
Black Mage, by design, is a bad job for progression. So if you try to fix the lack of utility with a tool for progression in a job that's naturally bad at that, you fix nothing. Why exactly aren't you taking RDM in progression?
Or better yet, the hyper mobile, infinite-mp, higher dps SMN?

Another dollar towards my sub, we found another person who just can't seem to muster the imagination to realize that a balanced game requires more than "it's not in the lore".

I don't propose raise on BLM because it needs to be a rez dispenser (which you would know if you'd read my proposal for how I'd implement it), or even because I think that will somehow magically fix all of its problems, but simply because it could then bring that option to the table just like every single other disciple of magic does. Furthermore, if you want to start a lore argument, why DOESN'T Paladin have raise? It is absolutely in its lore, that and lay on hands. Give please.

And to answer your question, because I don't want to have to play a job that I don't want to have to play "for progression's sake". That also flies directly against "any class comp can do any content" that SE preaches so hard. Some classes may be better for progression than others, this is natural, but one class being SO OBVIOUSLY PAINFULLY BAD for progression is unacceptable. All these factors add together into why BLM is an awful choice to bring into raid, the most glaring of which currently is the class's failure to live up to its supposed role (raw damage as utility).