When dps dont aoe should they just get kicked from the start?

[HyoMinPark]

It's just a game folks. Kicking people because their dps isn't close to the top 1% is dumb. Not everyone wants to be pro. They play the game to have fun. They are not interested in spending endless hours reading up on theorycrafting and practicing the perfect rotation on a training dummy.

Knowing to use AOE rotation in appropriate situations is not Top 1% Play.
AOEing a trash pack of 8-10 mobs is not Top 1% Play.
No one is saying they expect all DPS in Expert or Leveling Roulette to be 99th percentile.

[KaijinRhada]

but some that focus more on single target damage, say monk and drg...AOE can be less effective on some mob pulls vs what they can do singly.

Out of all the comments in the thread so far, this still boggles my mind the most. Any monk or dragoon worth their salt will AoE and AoE well. Rockbreaker and Fist of the Destroyer (on four or more targets) aren't there for show. As shown in previous posts, you math it out and use your abilities as required. If a tank mass pulls, AoE will be the most efficient until you reach single-target thresholds again.

[Aylis]

II just don't get how people could see it differently.

The only real answer I can give is..."it is what it is". Is it wrong or not right? Absolutely, but such is life and life can be unfair at times and you won't always get what you want or expect. DF in any game will always be a mixed bag, you'll meet amazing players, mediocre players and dead weight players, It is what it is and if I do join DF in any game I accept the hand that was delt me. If I get a dead weight player yes I could complain all day long, but what good will it do other then further slowing the run down. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink. I could just go at my normal pace and assume everyone is amazing and just cause further wipes and rage myself more. Or I can just simply tune myself up or down to the situation and be done with it at the end. Or if its really that hopeless I have no problem taking my penalty and just dropping.

I choose the last two simply because I can adjust myself on the fly for whatever party the hand of fate gave to me, and I know this games dungeons and tokens ain't going anywhere, or any other games I play. So if I miss a dungeon on one day. I'm not gonna lose sleep over it because tomorrow is another day.

[missybee]

No. Please stop the "my way is the only way and any other way is the stupid ass retarded lazy loser way elitist top 1%" nonsense. The world does not revolve around you. Stop trying to shape the DF. It doesn't work.

It's been said over and over, and I'm going to say it again: if you want group content to go a specific way, use the Party Finder.

Weird how that can go either way.

Expecting someone to cast Scatter repeatedly, for instance, isn't asking much. If anything, I feel like AoE rotations tend to be the simpler ones.

[Awful]

It's just a game folks. Kicking people because their dps isn't close to the top 1% is dumb. Not everyone wants to be pro. They play the game to have fun. They are not interested in spending endless hours reading up on theorycrafting and practicing the perfect rotation on a training dummy.

I don't want super top tier DPS I want an actual DPS not someone who does 1-2-3 and spams 1 button, AFKing, not contributing if I wanted to undersize the dungeon with the 3 people who are pulling their weight I could or I could y'know, kick the AFK person and get a 4th. People want a team effort they never said they want the top tier crazy perfect DPS nor has it been requested in any of these threads.

[bswpayton]

It's just a game folks. Kicking people because their dps isn't close to the top 1% is dumb. Not everyone wants to be pro. They play the game to

explain to me how using an aoe is top 1 percent play thats literally like sayin just because you use one skill your an endgame raider. Once again i ask the question if its a mob of 12 adds and im on monk and im hitting only one but yet I see the others health going down as well.

Then whos doing more work the person thats attacking 12 adds at once or me picking out my one add i want to focus on. I dont understand how anyone can argue wit this, if i kill two adds with my single target dps that means the other people killed 10, so am I suppose to feel like Im actually being a team player doing this, it has nothing to do wit top tier dps nothing at all.

[Brill_]

I don't want super top tier DPS I want an actual DPS not someone who does 1-2-3 and spams 1 button, AFKing, not contributing if I wanted to undersize the dungeon with the 3 people who are pulling their weight I could or I could y'know, kick the AFK person and get a 4th. People want a team effort they never said they want the top tier crazy perfect DPS nor has it been requested in any of these threads.

Sure they do. People want the fastest run possible, that means expecting everyone to put out max dps.

[Awful]

Sure they do. People want the fastest run possible, that means expecting everyone to put out max dps.

You don't need "the best" DPS to speed clear a dungeon you literally need: a group of 4 people who are all contributing to clear the dungeon by using all their abilities and their toolkits not someone who is half assing it and being AFK. Sure some do not gonna lie but the majority i.e people who are aware and who use DF regularly want a 4th body that isn't filling up a heart beat.

You can speed clear with 2 Mchs AoEing and a white mage and a Pld AoEing their hearts out VS a group who has a SMN, White mage, Pld, and a Blm where the Blm and summoner aren't AoEing and the white mage is spamming Holy making up for 2 of those DPS who could be AoEing but choose not to along with the Pld doing their AoE. What group is gonna be faster? The group that's more active.

That's the argument being made no one is expecting super fast top tier raid DPS they want people to contribute and benefit the group.

[Snow_Princess]

I am a healer main, if stuff is standing too long because people are single target on mega pulls, it can wipe, easy esp if the tank is not using CDS. THERE IS NO REASON I HAVE TO 10X STRESS because people refuse to AoE, I will say something, you will cooperate or get kicked because you are making me stress way too much because someone else putting little effort. This should not be a debate, we should not be defending subpar performance, we are not talking about top 1% DPS , we are not taking about double ogcd while on CD, we are talking about being somewhat competent in doing rotations, basic ability everyone should be able to do. Since they have a level 60+ job, it means you should know how to aoe, it is expected, it is expected to put some effort in your own performance, not depend 3 others to be putting 5-10x more effort because you want to afk or something.

[Elkanah]

snip

If you want competency, get 3 other players to go with you in the future. Otherwise, you're expecting WAY too much of the community. Everyone plays this game for many and different reasons. Some to get away and enjoy what they play, and some of us (raiders) who have end goals and achieving higher progressive content. But in no way, shape or form is it justified to kick a player just because YOU decide what should be beneficial to the group. I'm not saying you're wrong on the problem, but kicking players because they're not doing what you and the group is asking is toxic to the group and you're part of the problem (not you, but the player kicking said player for those reasons).

Players being offline, harassing others and saying things that aren't necessary, are kick-able offense. If you have an aoe player in the group like blm or rdm and they're doing their job, resume your normal routine with the party. Again, if you really want someone to do what you need to, to get a dungeon cleared, it's smarter to bring 3 others who have the same understanding and mutual agreement. Don't expect the thousands and thousands of players to be on the same bed of dreams and goals. Anything outside of raid endgame should not be kicked without legitimate reasons.

If in raid and they're under performing, then yes, you have every right to kick them, as endgame is not a piece of content meant for casual players who want to "have fun and play the game". You do that on normal raids and other content in the game.