PLD Consolidated Feedback Thread

[Reynhart]

DRK's do not lose a GCD when switching FROM Tankstance TO Non-tankstance/DPS Stance as I laid it out in my original post.

It's because, technically, Darkside is not a "stance". For SwO to be oGCD, you would be able to activate both ShO and SwO.
What they should do is simply buff PLD AA, remove SwO and bring back ShO to -20% damage to compensate (And maybe increase the cost of activating ShO).
SwO is the most bland stance since it's the only one to not change how you play your class at all. Even ShO synergize with Holy Spirit.

[Drakcane]

One of the changes I would like to see, is a heal spell sooner then we get Clemency at Lv. 58... with the old cross class system we had cure 1, and I made do with that. But now the only skill that heals at all is Clemency... so doing any lower level dungeons I have no heals and I feel very un-paladin like.

[Dortharl]

I think our gage could use some tuning as right now it seems to be a largely unnecessary extra resource. I understand that the devs wanted everyone to have one but objectively what does it add to the PLD class?

[DWolfwood]

PC Master race.

I play on PC lol. I just prefer controller leaps and bounds over keyboard/mouse. This is coming from someone who only uses kb/m for shooters and nearly every PC game. That said, I do tend to prefer controller for 3rd person games even before taking into account how much more fluid I think controls are on controller in XIV.

In XI and 1.x, I used kb/m, but every skill was pretty much an OGCD back then, so was less carpel tunnel syndrome inducing.

But yeah, they had said one of the reasons for this whole reduction was to help out controller users, also saying the number of actions would stay the same. Just so happened to be false in regards to PLD.

[Thoro39]

It's because, technically, Darkside is not a "stance". For SwO to be oGCD, you would be able to activate both ShO and SwO.
What they should do is simply buff PLD AA, remove SwO and bring back ShO to -20% damage to compensate (And maybe increase the cost of activating ShO).
SwO is the most bland stance since it's the only one to not change how you play your class at all. Even ShO synergize with Holy Spirit.

Your first two sentences do not make any sense. One does not have anything to do with the other, and making SwordOath OffGCD would not cause you being able to activate both SHo and SwO at the same time unless specifically requested and implemented (which I did not).
On another note, this talk about "stance" is unnecessarily focused on semantics and does not contribute anything meaningful.
For all intents and purposes, Grit+ Darkside is the tankstance and nogrit+darkside is the dps stance in terms of gameplay, migitation and dps-output and you do not lose a GCD going from this specified "Tankstance" to "DPS stance" as a DRK, and that's all whats important for the topic I suggested. This talk about "But darkside is not a stance"? Not relevant or in any way meaningful at all.

Your supposed change would exactly do what I suggested, with 1 less button to care about, so that's fine by me, however.

You lose half of one.

Turning Grit off is still on the GCD, it just doesn't trigger the GCD. This is probably one of the most poorly proliferated pieces of information regarding Grit in the entire meta.

Half one is a grand exaggeration. Super grand exaggeration.
You can prequeue in your "Turnoff-Grit" action before the GCD becomes ready, just like you can prequeue/buffer any other OGCD after a GCD and the OGCD gets used as soon as the innate animationlock of using a GCD expires.
Activate Grit, execute one normal Hardslash GCD, press grit again when the GCD clock is finished at around 80%. You will see that Grit turns off as soon as your GCD becomes fully 100% ready without a second buttonpress and barely, if any delay.

I even made a webm-videodemonstration to show it:
https://webmshare.com/MJwYZ
You'd be joking if THAT is supposed to be a half-GCD loss, let alone a quarter one.

[aqskerorokero]

ppl tend to forgot that dark knight is the only be able to use both stance in the same or if you do consider the stance talking it's the only tank that can bypass the tank stance penalty permanently

[Reynhart]

Your first two sentences do not make any sense. One does not have anything to do with the other, and making SwordOath OffGCD would not cause you being able to activate both SHo and SwO at the same time unless specifically requested and implemented (which I did not).

I don't recall any other situation where two different types of abilities cancel each other. I'm not even sure the system would manage this properly. Feel free to correct me if I've overlooked current skills that work that way.

On another note, this talk about "stance" is unnecessarily focused on semantics and does not contribute anything meaningful.

Problem is, system-wise, this is the reason why DRK don't lose a GCD (or mana) to be in "DPS stance", because it's not a DPS stance, but only the lack of Grit, and, as a universal rule right now, deactivating a skill is free and doesn't start any timer.

[Thoro39]

I don't recall any other situation where two different types of abilities cancel each other. I'm not even sure the system would manage this properly. Feel free to correct me if I've overlooked current skills that work that way.

You have one. It's called warrior, both their stances are offgcd. If you start in Defiance, do a GCD and activate deliverance, Deliverance eliminates the Defiance Debuff. Similarily, you could make swordoath OGCD and make its activation eliminate any Shieldoath buffs. So the system to implement that is already there.

I don't recall any other situation where two different types of abilities cancel each other. I'm not even sure the system would manage this properly. Feel free to correct me if I've overlooked current skills that work that way.

Problem is, system-wise, this is the reason why DRK don't lose a GCD (or mana) to be in "DPS stance", because it's not a DPS stance, but only the lack of Grit, and, as a universal rule right now, deactivating a skill is free and doesn't start any timer.

Which was exactly my point? The point that PLD's current iteration of swordoath is unnecessarily clunky and thus should be changed into something more fluid like DRK's method of turning of tankstance. Which is exactly why I'm pretty fine with the suggestion you posted as well. Systemwise, DRK has a more fluid way in switching from Tankstance to Non-tankstance/Dps-stance, and systemwise, Paladin should be changed to have a similarily fluidway of that particular switch.


Eitherway, you should probably stop initiating talks about Systemlimitations here.
Neither me, nor probably you are Developers of the FFXIV DevTeam, and thus, starting a conversation about systemlimitations is just initiating an uneducated debate between a man with no facts against a man with no facts, entirely meaningless and a waste of textspace. UNLESS you have a specific official Dev-comment that you can derive your concerns from.
The only thing endusers like us can do is talking about how gameplay feels and what we do not like about it. It is the devteam's job to make the system work around gameplay and gameplay adjustments and we should not limit our complaints to what's feasible to the current system exactly because we do NOT know the current systemlimitations ourselves.
If they say it's currently not possible due to systemlimitations, fine, but until no official word has been said, any complaint is fair to be voiced out and should not be dismissed by "It MIGHT not work in the current system, I'm not a developer though, so I have no clue", because that could be said to literally everything and any suggestions, and provides no meaningful argument nor contribution to the actual topic.

[Dortharl]

It's sad the the Paladin feedback is mostly full DRKs coming to complain. While I'm sure DRKs have issues there is already a thread for feedback on that class.

[Freyyy]

ppl tend to forgot that dark knight is the only be able to use both stance in the same or if you do consider the stance talking it's the only tank that can bypass the tank stance penalty permanently

1. Darkside isn't a stance

2. Darkside doesn't bypass the tank stance penalty at all since you also get the damage bonus from Darkside when you're out of Grit. So Grit still reduces your damage by the same 20% compared to Gritless, and on top of that we can't use Blood Weapon with Grit on. So it's actually a bit more than a 20% loss.