Please nerf RDM!

[Sstromquist]

I stated 80th percentile and above, meaning people that actually can play their jobs well. Rdm falls behind monk. If you argue lower percentiles, what's the point? People that don't understand the job won't play as well and it all comes down to skill cap and how they benefit from party buffs.

That's the only question I have. Everything else you mentioned, party synergy with melees. Rez and what not, it doesn't matter.

Monk played by good players beats Rdm.

[RuneSevalle]

Rdm and Sam are fine, aside of the fact, that they don't get punished like others .

no class should be perfect all around, each should have some setback, just like having some advantage over others..

You want to punish classes just to punish classes? That's some serious Social Justice you're spouting there. SE has made it clear they want each job to feel unique, and being less punishing is just another factor of uniqueness. As long as the end numbers are relatively balanced, ease of use/lack of punishment should never ever be a factor of balance.

[Wavaryen]

My main class is a Red Mage and I do not see that changing in the foreseeable future.

Sure though, class envy.

Oh? But you could be doing better dps as sam, or heck even BLM do better once they fix RDM mana bug.

But hey, it is fine with me..I will keep playing my bard. I love rdm in my groups.

[HoLoFoNo]

One jiffy later, 95th percentile info:

SAM = 3977
MNK = 3736
RDM = 3679
BLM = 3628
NIN = 3622
SMN = 3494
BRD = 3458
DRG = 3441
MCH = 3353

RDM + Embolden = 3843
MNK + Brohood = 3845
NIN + Trick = 3994
SMN + Devotion = 3522
BRD + Utility = 3917
DRG + Litany and Dragon Sight = 3651
MCH + Hypercharge = 3604

I forgot to do this with 75th percentile data, but for all intents and purposes, lets say BRD and MCH parses most likely have a DRG, so to factor them in without a DRG (pretty common since DRGs aren't loved atm) we will remove 4% dps.

Sad MCH + hypercharge = 3475
Sad BRD + Utility = 3784

Also for a DRG that is helping out a BRD/MCH, lets add 5% dps (DoTs aren't effected, MCH benefits more then BRD, The number i have is from averaging BRD and MCH dps and adding 5%)

DRG + Disembowel and friends = 3821

Ranking at 95th percentile:

1 - NIN
2 - SAM
3 - MNK
4 - RDM
5 - Sad BRD
6 - Lonely DRG
7 - BLM
8 - SMN
9 - Sad MCH

Alternatively:

1 - NIN
2 - SAM
3 - BRD
4 - MNK
5 - RDM
6 - DRG
7 - MCH
8 - BLM
9 - SMN

So, as before use this very general laymans info in conjunction with classes non offensive utility (you know the offenders) and their ease of use coupled with their leniency in a fight, and judge balance. Also take note of the large gaps between certain placements (anything with 100 dps or more).

[HoLoFoNo]

I stated 80th percentile and above, meaning people that actually can play their jobs well. Rdm falls behind monk. If you argue lower percentiles, what's the point? People that don't understand the job won't play as well and it all comes down to skill cap and how they benefit from party buffs.

That's the only question I have. Everything else you mentioned, party synergy with melees. Rez and what not, it doesn't matter.

Monk played by good players beats Rdm.

Well first of all, If you wanna play it like that then at the 100th percentile (top dps for the class) RDM beats MNK by about 200 dps.

Second, the whole point is that the class has such a low ceiling and floor, which is why it is an issue RDM being high. This accounts for the majority of percentiles as it shows that on average, RDM does better than MNK. It's not only about knowing how to play your class because fights aren't that nice; Take susano for example. If he decides to rock you you're fucked. MNK loses greased lightning and is SOL without PB. From what I know RDM would likely lose the dualcast proc and that's it, they retain their mana distribution. Being rocked can change you from 95th percentile to 75th, coupled with stuns and pushback rng.

Missing positionals also hampers MNKs dps and with the ridiculous timer of true north coupled with the SB bosses liking to turn, you lose DPS much easier on MNK for example, and it isn't even a hard class. This issue gets compounded with more punishing classes like DRG and SMN and they aren't even close to RDM dps. That is the issue.

[Shiroe]

You want to punish classes just to punish classes? That's some serious Social Justice you're spouting there. SE has made it clear they want each job to feel unique, and being less punishing is just another factor of uniqueness. As long as the end numbers are relatively balanced, ease of use/lack of punishment should never ever be a factor of balance.

It should be more balanced, since all classes get somehow punished during mechanics if not careful.., rdm and Sam practically the least of all, .... and are OP too

[Dualgunner]

It should be more balanced, since all classes get somehow punished during mechanics if not careful.., rdm and Sam practically the least of all, .... and are OP too

SAM loses jinpu, shifu, and yukikaze (if there's no warrior/ninja keeping slashing up). To reapply these, if you were gonna focus buffs instead of sens, would take 6 GCDs, 2 of which at regular GCD if you prioritized Shifu. If you decided to keep pushing sens, that turns into 8 GCDs, 9 if Hinganbana fell off because that takes priority, just to wind back up after a lull of damage. It also provides no unique utility, and the slashing isn't like it was back in 3.x where WAR applying it allowed Ninja to use their BnB combo more, boosting their damage.

Speaking of "practically least punished of all" ...Ninja loses...what exactly? They stop generating Ninki, sure. But it doesn't drop off. Huton? No...they can just reapply that willy-nilly. Oh! Slashing! They were gonna put that back up anyway because of the DoT. Hm...

[Shiroe]

Samsung punishments are too minor compared to other dps + Sam has good gab closers/increases..

but agree, nin has it easy to come compared to others.., use to have the lowest melee dps for that reason too, besides it's utility..

balancing is just so off, doing the same dps with a blm as smn? behind rdm..., getting punished like he'll during Susano stuns, stones, etc. as a casters, other than rdm

the live letter infos do not adresse this for dps enough

[KuroTenshi]

Samsung punishments are too minor compared to other dps + Sam has good gab closers/increases..

but agree, nin has it easy to come compared to others.., use to have the lowest melee dps for that reason too, besides it's utility..

balancing is just so off, doing the same dps with a blm as smn? behind rdm..., getting punished like he'll during Susano stuns, stones, etc. as a casters, other than rdm

the live letter infos do not adresse this for dps enough

Losing buffs on SAM is really similar to losing greased lightning. I don't understand why people regard that as a non-issue, your damage takes a massive 10% hit and 10% GCD hit. 20% hit on damage if you're in control of the slashing debuff. Plus your tank's damage will take a hit if you are as well. Also if you use your cooldown to reapply buffs on SAM you're doing it completely wrong as well, so there's no way to 'fix' it you just have to ramp up all over again.

[MidnightTundra]

Losing buffs on SAM is no where near as punishing as losing greased lightning III; what are you talking about.

This is coming from someone who plays both MNK and SAM.