Tanks that think they are DPS, just stop...

[Odstarva]

And yes you are bad if your sitting in grit. It's a fact not a matter of opinion.

I can only assume people talking about dropping tank stance in EX encounters have been doing it with static groups, whose dps never make mistakes and thus have healers ready to get you back to 100%. But then, how bad would those DPS have to be that you wouldn't lose aggro by staying in dps stance throughout?

Or would you spam your aggro combo while in dps stance in perpetuity.
In which case, isn't it better to be in tank stance and instead use the dps rotation? Without losing any enmity? Would also let your healers dps (which I'm sure can pull in far greater numbers).


I've tried and I really don't understand how any one tank can maintain a dps rotation, while in dps stance, and not lose aggro to a competent team.

[Hruodig]

I can only assume people talking about dropping tank stance in EX encounters have been doing it with static groups, whose dps never make mistakes and thus have healers ready to get you back to 100%. But then, how bad would those DPS have to be that you wouldn't lose aggro by staying in dps stance throughout?

Or would you spam your aggro combo while in dps stance in perpetuity.
In which case, isn't it better to be in tank stance and instead use the dps rotation? Without losing any enmity? Would also let your healers dps (which I'm sure can pull in far greater numbers).


I've tried and I really don't understand how any one tank can maintain a dps rotation, while in dps stance, and not lose aggro to a competent team.

Coordinated use of dps's aggro dumps and shirk. Not really too hard.

[Odstarva]

Coordinated use of dps's aggro dumps and shirk. Not really too hard.

So, your healers don't get to dps at all during a fight like susano, I'd imagine. I mean, even with tank stance and cooldowns -it hurts-.

Are you sure your dps is worth more than that of the healers? By any measure?

Because all DPS now have a way to reduce enmity output and any good Tank knows how to maintain their enmity generation.

Usually, once you establish your aggro lead, you're pretty much set on holding it for the rest of the fight unless the DPS outgear you or they have a particular nasty burst rotation.

Sure, I can maintain enmity generation but then I won't be able to roll my dps rotation. And I can say good-night to the blackest night (arguably my best mitigation ability) without a means to recover mp, if I'm stuck in enmity rotation.

[Hruodig]

So, your healers don't get to dps at all during a fight like susano, I'd imagine. I mean, even with tank stance and cooldowns -it hurts-.

Are you sure your dps is worth more than that of the healers? By any measure?

My healers put out a combined 2285 dps on our last susano ex clear, not really sure what you're talking about.

[ADVSS]

So, your healers don't get to dps at all during a fight like susano, I'd imagine. I mean, even with tank stance and cooldowns -it hurts-.

Are you sure your dps is worth more than that of the healers? By any measure?

it should be, Tanks are basically expected to whack enemies to hold their attention, healers are supposed to whack allies to keep them alive.
And the diversion excuse is stupid too. It lazilly "shirks" a tanks responsibility of commanding and controlling hate to the dps. If they had any since Shirk wouldve been Yoink - a skill that steals enmity from the entire party at the tanks command and gives it to them. No healer or dps wants that much aggro on them except in some unvonventional settings, that go against the predetermined party set up anyway

making dps solely responsible for enmity generation, taking that away from tanks, and their damage/enmity generating stat, then angering both the healing community and tank community for trying to make dps more responsible and bore tanks to death with a snorefest, vit only yoy dont deal damage now you tank, and let dps use enmity controlling skills or you lose hate, rediculous. Just pushing more tanks away, and thats not what we want

The only reason shirk is even a good ability is for those dark knights that didnt bother levelling gladiator to get provoke. Oh wait that cant happen anymore.

[Kinkoz]

And the diversion excuse is stupid too. It lazilly "shirks" a tanks responsibility of commanding and controlling hate to the dps.

You sound like one of those Red Mages who bursts and rips aggro right off a Tank without using Diversion, dies, and then cries that it's not YOUR fault, "the Tank should just be better at their job!" just because you've had Tanks that have had to overcompensate for your burst potential with Provoke and nonstop use of their enmity combo.

EDIT: Unless, of course, you meant something completely different by that. In which case, I apologize for my inflammatory remark, as it's become quite irksome to see this somewhat popular DPS mindset of "I shouldn't be expected to use Diversion whatsoever! The Tank should just play better!"

[Ameela]

So, your healers don't get to dps at all during a fight like susano, I'd imagine. I mean, even with tank stance and cooldowns -it hurts-.

After the first phase he barely tickles you lol, anyone who can properly time and use their cooldowns can tank that fight in DPS stance while not making their healer's life a nightmare, unless you have one of those healers that always has to keep you at full HP even if you're only missing like 500.

[Kinkoz]

Are you sure your dps is worth more than that of the healers? By any measure?

Just the same that a good Tank can hold aggro while doing their DPS rotations almost nonstop, a fantastic Healer can put out respectable DPS while still keeping the party up and healthy in almost any circumstance.

It doesn't take much to re-establish your enmity lead if it starts to falter either. Sneaking in one or two of your enmity combos in the middle of your rotation is more than enough in most cases.

[Kinkoz]

I've tried and I really don't understand how any one tank can maintain a dps rotation, while in dps stance, and not lose aggro to a competent team.

Because all DPS now have a way to reduce enmity output and any good Tank knows how to maintain their enmity generation.

Usually, once you establish your aggro lead, you're pretty much set on holding it for the rest of the fight unless the DPS outgear you or they have a particular nasty burst rotation.

[Felorr]

I've tried and I really don't understand how any one tank can maintain a dps rotation, while in dps stance, and not lose aggro to a competent team.

Sounds like you should start by finding a competent team to try it with.