Echo seem be still need

[Vidu]

He's the end boss. The big bad. He needs to have some difficulty. Want easy fights? PLay a single player game on easy difficulty. This game has had too many fight nerfed to the ground already. Leave this one be.

This. So much this. Whats the point in having an endboss when its basically just another striking dummy. Thats a hugeass dragon there, a powerful primal - why do people just want him to drop dead as soon as they did so much as poke him?

[DracotheDragon]

ZOOP!.

but how is this boss difficult

(hidden due to mechanic spoilers)

"oh look water that pushes us we go to it." "oh ice on the floor we dont move" "oh a GIANT AOE lets not stand in it" to be honest it is a really easy fight mechanically, the only real 'hard part' is the meteors, and even then 'oh look a spot where a meteor ISNT landing i'll stand there' its not hard at all. most parties in my roulets i get are 1 wipe then they clear, always at the same point as well.

:/ i really hope this doesn't get nerfed this is a exciting fight that isnt that hard to do when people focus normally.

[HyperSMB]

-snip-

Dungeons are a joke and always have been.

The challenge from this game is from Savage and EX Trials. MSQ should NEVER impede anyone. What they do after the story is their business IMHO.

MSQ is essentially FFXIV's "Easy Mode". It should be just that.

[Rokke]

Ok, I think you need to step back and check the eilitism. The final boss of this MSQ is tough. No, to seasoned raiders (which with your attitude I am going to assume you have to be) it isn't a big deal, but to the new player who bought jump potion or the NUMEROUS players who only do normal level raids, he is a beast with numeroues instant wipe (barring GREAT healer recovery) mechanics.

Step back and assess it from the vantage point of the 50%, not the 95%.

He likely is a candidate for a nerf, most likely to outgoing damage. I will say though, I prefer a general change to an echo buff for the MSQ.

(Before you ask, yes I raid, yes I beat him without too much effort)

I don't raid and its still not hard.
Nearly every mechanic is rehashed from another fight in the game.

I went in blind + half of my team hadn't done their lv 70 quest. It took 3 tries.

[TaranTatsuuchi]

Dungeons are a joke and always have been.

The challenge from this game is from Savage and EX Trials. MSQ should NEVER impede anyone. What they do after the story is their business IMHO.

MSQ is essentially FFXIV's "Easy Mode". It should be just that.

There's a case to be made about having an increasing difficulty curve throught a game's story mode...
Teaching the players to get better as they go along by requiring them to ever so slowly beat progressivly tougher challenges...


I wonder what ffxiv would be like if the story was like that...

[HyperSMB]

There's a case to be made about having an increasing difficulty curve throught a game's story mode...
Teaching the players to get better as they go along by requiring them to ever so slowly beat progressivly tougher challenges...


I wonder what ffxiv would be like if the story was like that...

Bad will still be bad. As soon as people find out the minimum they can do, many will do just that. To think otherwise is kind of silly.

[Vidu]

Dungeons are a joke and always have been.

The challenge from this game is from Savage and EX Trials. MSQ should NEVER impede anyone. What they do after the story is their business IMHO.

MSQ is essentially FFXIV's "Easy Mode". It should be just that.

But how easy should it be? I'm not asking for bloody savage-difficulty in normal content, I'm just saying: it shouldnt hurt if people actually have to do something in the final boss fight of a game.

Single player RPGs will block if you cant beat a boss - and what do you do then? Ask for a patch to make it easier or revise your stratgey and improve?
(Funny enough: when I played FFX for the first time I got hardcore stuck on Efry, that dragon on the airship - but you know what I did? I went and improved. If people cant do mechanics on a boss after reaching level 70, they might wanna do the same. If you dont want a challenge and only see the story: might aswell watch a lets play!)

[DracotheDragon]

There's a case to be made about having an increasing difficulty curve throught a game's story mode...
Teaching the players to get better as they go along by requiring them to ever so slowly beat progressivly tougher challenges...


I wonder what ffxiv would be like if the story was like that...

*points to FFXI* XD

Bad will still be bad. As soon as people find out the minimum they can do, many will do just that. To think otherwise is kind of silly.

well then time to raise the bar, even if just by a bit. (ignoring the jump poitons for the moment) this is level 70, by now, players should understand the basics of there jobs and be able to play quite well or at least on a adaquite level. thats why people were asking for a hall of the intermediate, so people could learn harder battles and skills.

[Zojha]

Single player RPGs will block if you cant beat a boss - and what do you do then?

In many, if not most modern single-player RPGs, you can either directly adjust the difficulty while playing, or you can select the desired difficulty at the start of the game. If you don't feel comfortable with challenge, you can pick "Very Easy" and then stuff will be pushovers and you can lean back and enjoy the story. Many also allow for brute-force approaches via overleveling, consumable spam or cheap tactics (I'm looking at you, failure fusion/dungeons).

Further, if push comes to shove, you can always cheat in single-player games without risking your account. Fiddling with game files isn't that hard on a PC.

It's also not uncommon in single-player RPGs for the rewards to be identical regardless of which difficulty you played the game on. Almost unthinkable in MMORPG. Likewise, having builds that intentionally gimp yourself to provide a greater challenge - not socially acceptable in multi-player games, no issue in single-player games.

So yeah... I don't think comparing the two is a good idea. Multiplayer games are a very different beast to single-player games, especially when it comes to accessibility - MMOs don't have a whole lot of options there.

That said: The fight seems to be fairly recoverable, so with a little bit of gearing, I wager the skilled people who know the fight will just be able to carry the deadweight through so those won't need to change. There aren't many mechanics where one person can wipe everyone and my own groups got through in fairly few attempts precisely due to that.

[RaizeGraymalkin]

POTENTIAL 4.0 SPOILERS - STOP READING








Someone just reached the 4.0 final fight. If you can't do this by 70 then you don't deserve endgame. It's all basic boss skills we've seen 100 times.

Maybe not everyone is looking for end game? Also that fight is way overtuned. Consider everything else the game throws at you up until that point. The difficulty spike is a bit much. This is a MSQ not Savage. It doesn't need to be mindless like Thordan, but it's a bridge too far.

It's definitely gonna get nerfed.

This. So much this. Whats the point in having an endboss when its basically just another striking dummy. Thats a hugeass dragon there, a powerful primal - why do people just want him to drop dead as soon as they did so much as poke him?

As I already said it's a story boss. Story is for casuals. The constant bitching about "waaaaaah everything needs to be savage" is silly. Most of the playerbase is casual.