Summoner Over-Nered (and A few other Problems)

[SendohJin]

If players are playing a class one way... and enjoying it... why ruin it? What's wrong with a class having decent dps numbers?

Their logic is that low skill players do not know how to play it that way, so when you run into someone like that, they are really really bad at it.

I'm kind of okay with them taking it away but I wish they would give us something to do inside DWT besides casting Ruin 3.

[Ariomi]

Their logic is that low skill players do not know how to play it that way, so when you run into someone like that, they are really really bad at it.

I'm kind of okay with them taking it away but I wish they would give us something to do inside DWT besides casting Ruin 3.

This doesn't fix anything though. If people don't know how to play the class, encourage them to seek out more experienced players of that class...

I ran into a summoner back in HW that didn't know how to death flare... How much do we need our hand held?

[SendohJin]

This doesn't fix anything though. If people don't know how to play the class, encourage them to seek out more experienced players of that class...

That never happens with most people, they've had years of data to support this.

[Exterium]

Classes like Bard dragoon and Samurai can outdps summoners by 600 dps

??????????????????????????

Where have you seen bards hitting as hard as samurai? SMN can in fact outdps bards by 500 or 600 dps, BRD keeps the spot because it gives around 600 DPS to a full raid with all of its buffs, and also, because it solves all the "I'm out of mana" SMN QQ.

[hiedra]

The answers to these questions would all be opinion based, but...

- Do you guys think that SE will be fixing this? Is the Japanese player base as bummed as we are?
- If SE does fix this will we be stuck waiting until 5.0 for the fixes?

I loved Summoner, but I'm not sure I like it now. I'm still leveling it to 70 just to see how it plays at max level, but I don't know. The lower DPS I could tolerate if the new rotation were at least fun, but right now it just feels like I'm spamming ruin more than ever.

[Ariomi]

??????????????????????????

Where have you seen bards hitting as hard as samurai? SMN can in fact outdps bards by 500 or 600 dps, BRD keeps the spot because it gives around 600 DPS to a full raid with all of its buffs, and also, because it solves all the "I'm out of mana" SMN QQ.

No class hits as hard as samurai, although I have been made well aware of bards being able to hit for 25k. Bard's dots also outperform Summoner's. Look at Caustic Bite and Stormbite. 5 and 15 potency per tick higher then both of summoner's dots but bard's get 120 potency on the application.

[Exterium]

No class hits as hard as samurai, although I have been made well aware of bards being able to hit for 25k. Bard's dots also outperform Summoner's. Look at Caustic Bite and Stormbite. 5 and 15 potency per tick higher then both of summoner's dots but bard's get 120 potency on the application.

You "may" hit for 25k if all planets line up and you get a direct hit crit barraged refulgent arrow while under Raging Strikes, that may not happen ever in a 2 hour raid, in fact, I've only seen this ONCE in all my SB bard playtime.

You never reapply your dots, they get refreshed with a 100 potency weaponskill.

I don't talk about what I think, I talk about the data we have at this point, and SMN, besides what this forum seems to think, hits way harder than BRD, at the same lvl as a BLM and harder than a RDM.

EDIT: You seem to be forgetting your third dot, you, and every summoner, your pet is essentially a 110 potency dot with utility.

[Ariomi]

I don't talk about what I think, I talk about the data we have at this point, and SMN, besides what this forums seems to think, hits way harder than BRD, at the same lvl as a BLM and harder than a RDM.

And as far as I've seen, this just isn't true. I've been in parties, I've seen people's dps. I have been in. Nothing Summoner has can hit for 25k and I did stone sky sea over and over and over until I got an ahk morn direct hit crit under the effect of contagion that boosts it's damage. I also tweaked my smn rotation right around 30 times and yet when I encounter a bard, they do massively more dps.


Smn and Bard dots work almost identical, except they are reversed. Bard hard casts dots then keeps them up. Summoner doesn't have to hard cast their dots until they run out three times. The difference? Bard get's 120 potency when they first cast them on both dots, then 100 potency when they need to refresh them. Summoner's dot's don't get any potency added when we refresh them unless we hard cast Miasma 3.

[Exterium]

snip

This is like talking to a wall...

It doesn't matter how big the number is, it doesn't matter AT ALL, what matters is the overall DPS, judging damage by "big dick hits" is just plain stupid.

How are BRD dots better than SMN dots? you have a pet that does the same a dot does, and adds 15 secs of magic vulnerability every minute, and it is a 110 potency dot, one hundred and ten, your pet alone is doing more dps than both BRD dots to a boss.

[Silverquick]

I've run into groups who won't run with smn cause their dps is too low.
Classes like Bard dragoon and Samurai can outdps summoners by 600 dps

As I'd said,

You are not the only one who is seeing this. I am seeing it from other quarters as well. And obviously from the thread linked on the last page... its not just a couple of people noticing the fall off.