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  1. #1
    Player
    Tonkra's Avatar
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    May 2011
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    2,084
    Character
    Quichy Sturmbruch
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 59
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariomi View Post
    There's no reason to believe that anything removed from the game is coming back ever.
    And thats a complete non-argument.

    Quote Originally Posted by Saito_S View Post
    Why? It's TWO DPS classes, both casters, that wold have a decent heal.

    How would that solve the lack of damage for summoners in any way now?

    On the contrary a summoner with "sustain" (pet heal over time) would grant you more dps, because with a better physick spell you would spend more time healing instead of doing damage. A heal over time heals automatically over time while you could perform damage spells.

    If you're going to talk down to people, at least know your shit.
    Yes and i know that FFXI and FFXIV rely on the traditional job class system (with the typical artifact armors) roles and whatever comes next to it. And it is not reyling on FFVII, FFIX or anything which have none of the traditional job class system. Which doesnt mean that these are influenced by them or come close to them.
    FF tactics makes use of the job system which strictly seperates the jobs from each other. How they do with FFXI and FFXIV (SMN/SCH are here the exception because they are the only jobs that share the base class)

    No one is asking for a strong cure spell on DRGs
    Well in the past i could have asked for my BLM to improve the healing effect of "Physick" while it was equipped as well..
    Why didnt i do it? Because i dont expect a damage dealer with huge burst damage like BLM to heal.

    an RDM is no substitute for a full healer in situations where serious damage is coming out. It's e backup/support/emergency tool, and of course is useful for solo'ing and in PotD, but that's all. Also SMN is already not pure-DPS all day, every day... Raise!! It's the only DPS class that can raise! (well, or was, before RDM). So how does that square with your paradigm?
    Thats because of the base class system which Yoshida wants to get rid actually. SMN has heal and raise just because they share the base class.
    (0)
    Last edited by Tonkra; 06-21-2017 at 06:58 PM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Ilenya's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    1,508
    Character
    Aurora Vlondett
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonkra View Post
    Yes and i know that FFXI and FFXIV rely on the traditional job class system (with the typical artifact armors) roles and whatever comes next to it. And it is not reyling on FFVII, FFIX or anything which have none of the traditional job class system. Which doesnt mean that these are influenced by them or come close to them.
    Legitimate question. You have played FFIX, right? Zidane, Steiner, Vivi, Kuja, all them? Because the more you mention that it didn't have traditional jobs, the more I wonder...
    (7)

  3. #3
    Player
    Tonkra's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
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    2,084
    Character
    Quichy Sturmbruch
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 59
    Quote Originally Posted by Ilenya View Post
    Legitimate question. You have played FFIX, right? Zidane, Steiner, Vivi, Kuja, all them? Because the more you mention that it didn't have traditional jobs, the more I wonder...
    Why do you come along with FFIX when its clear that FFXI and FFXIV jobs arent clearly based on these titles? You wont find a samurai or any other jobs like that in these titles..,



    additionally it makes me wonder how we came from "my pet dies very fast, they dropped of sustain, SMN's damage is too low" to a "i want to heal my party members". Then please give my BLM heal too, because it gives me a disadvantage not to heal and raise, while RDM and SMN are able to semi-heal
    (0)
    Last edited by Tonkra; 06-21-2017 at 07:05 PM.

  4. #4
    Player
    Ilenya's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    1,508
    Character
    Aurora Vlondett
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonkra View Post
    Why do you come along with FFIX when its clear that FFXI and FFXIV jobs arent clearly based on these titles? You wont find a samurai or any other jobs like that in these titles..,

    additionally it makes me wonder how we came from "my pet dies very fast, they dropped of sustain, SMN's damage is too low" to a "i want to heal my party members". Then please give my BLM heal too, because it gives me a disadvantage not to heal, while RDM and SMN are able to semi-heal
    I mentioned them because you said summoners didn't have the ability to heal outside of summons. I just gave you times when they did. Then you started saying some didn't follow the job system...Which again, I gave you the ones that did. You seem to be moving the goalposts on that, but either way, I would like to point out that comparing FFXI jobs to FFXIV jobs isn't even something you should be doing. They aren't the same.

    Point said, I've never specifically said SMN should have a strong heal. Most of my comments on the healing were traits that would keep the strength of physick currently the same, since we can assume it is not going anywhere, but give it an additional effect to heal the pets better (Either as a regen or just a stronger heal).

    Why did you list FFIII jobs there?
    (8)

  5. #5
    Player
    Ariomi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    184
    Character
    Ariyala Amaterasu
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonkra View Post
    Thats because of the base class system which Yoshida wants to get rid actually. SMN has heal and raise just because they share the base class.
    Yet.. Summoner used to be unique as the only dps class to rez. You are strangely hypocritical when it suits you.
    Red Mage now has Rez and Summoner is no longer unique.
    And Yoshi P has had plenty of time to get rid of the class system. Storm blood was a perfect opportunity to do so. Yet he didn't. Your arguments are flawed and your too toxic to offer any sort of constructive feedback.

    If you want to talk about old final fantasy games, Give Summoner knights of the round and let me solo most content. Or I'll happily pay Yojimbo to kill my enemies for me
    (10)

  6. #6
    Player
    Tonkra's Avatar
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    May 2011
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    2,084
    Character
    Quichy Sturmbruch
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 59
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariomi View Post
    Yet.. Summoner used to be unique as the only dps class to rez. You are strangely hypocritical when it suits you.
    Red Mage now has Rez and Summoner is no longer unique.
    Im hypocritical when it doesnt suit SMN and on the other hand doesnt solve the problem that you are talking about (dmg lack, pet dies often).

    A party member heal isnt there to solve these problems. if the problem would be "i cant heal my party members" that would be the strict solution for that, right. I would support your suggestion if in my opinion (and sorry that i am not your opinion) if it would straighten up the summoner what he is supposed to be (that is: doing damage and his pets). Which goes along with being able to keeping his pets alive or increasing the damage of the SMN itself or the pets.

    and this doesnt need a stronger party member healing skill. As i said im not against you, the summoner should be able to keep his pet alive. But i think increasing physick healing abillity is a squishy solution. Get rid of that useless spell and give him a proper pet heal.

    Storm blood was a perfect opportunity to do so. Yet he didn't. Your arguments are flawed and your too toxic to offer any sort of constructive feedback.
    I already gave constructive feedback here and that is: pet heal.

    Also in this thread here.. since the SMN has many other problems, and that is not "lacking in healing my party members" (having only garuda egi out for 80% of the time in groups).

    etc pp:
    http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...on-Bahamut-now..
    (0)
    Last edited by Tonkra; 06-21-2017 at 07:16 PM.

  7. #7
    Player
    Ariomi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    184
    Character
    Ariyala Amaterasu
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonkra View Post
    I(dmg lack, pet dies often).

    A party member heal isnt there to solve these problems.
    I already gave constructive feedback here and that is: pet heal.
    Summoner's lost their pet heal, It's not something that is likely to come back, just like 1.0 just like perfect dodge. Summoner's need a heal to use on their pet, is does nothing but help the group more if they have the option to make it heal party members. You haven't said a single constructive thing.

    Read through your suggestion page, Do you even know why old summoner's used Garuda 80% of the time? Your ideas sound like you don't even have a clue.
    (1)

  8. #8
    Player
    Caduagm's Avatar
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    Feb 2017
    Posts
    157
    Character
    Vincent Highwindus
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonkra View Post
    useless as aleays.
    Ok, let me ask you something.
    You are a BLM what are you even doing on this thread?
    Spreading toxicity for no reason?
    (13)

  9. #9
    Player
    Ariomi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2017
    Posts
    184
    Character
    Ariyala Amaterasu
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Caduagm View Post
    Ok, let me ask you something.
    You are a BLM what are you even doing on this thread?
    Spreading toxicity for no reason?
    Tonkra is toxic as he recently submitted a complete Summoner rework with new summons despite the fact that the summoner quests in ffxiv explain why you can't summon ramuh or other's like him. Ironically, he says in that post that he wants to make Summoners more useful in groups. It's really funny actually
    (11)

  10. #10
    Player
    Tonkra's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    2,084
    Character
    Quichy Sturmbruch
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 59
    with new summons despite the fact that the summoner quests in ffxiv explain why you can't summon ramuh or other's like him.
    Right, thats why you can summon demi-bahamut - its against the lore.. (which isnt the real bahamut it is a ghostly avatar). Last time: to heal party members doesnt solve any of your problems (lack of dps, unable to keep pets alive).

    Summoner needs a proper pet heal, better dps/pets and not a party member heal.

    Ironically, he says in that post that he wants to make Summoners more useful in groups. It's really funny actually
    yes because only one pet is useful in group there should be ways to make the other pets more usefull as well.


    End of story.
    (0)
    Last edited by Tonkra; 06-21-2017 at 07:24 PM.

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