Dam. meter

[Lium]

Damage meters have never really brought anything good to a community, in my opinion. I can see them being helpful in elite content of some type where you need to make sure everyone is performing optimally. But usually what ends up happening is people start using them in leveling dungeons and as a way to either stroke their own epeen or grief other players.

Check out the WoW forums if you want to see horror stories about getting kicked from groups for low DPS even though they were clearing the dungeon just fine and nobody was dying.

[akaneakki]

Damage meters have never really brought anything good to a community, in my opinion..

What about making parser only avaible for raid/extreme primals. Besides in these type of content you do need to do your fair share of dmg. And also those who said as long it's dead it doesn't matter. Well, good groups can do content with 7 people and also keep in mind, just because it's killed doesn't mean its fine for 1 guy to sit back and hit 1 button or looks like it every 15-20 seconds. That's called lazy/ungreatful/selfish.

[dragonseth07]

Check out the WoW forums if you want to see horror stories about getting kicked from groups for low DPS even though they were clearing the dungeon just fine and nobody was dying.

I'm familiar with it. And you can and should get kicked in a circumstances like that if you're not contributing still.

I can clear a dungeon just fine and nobody will die if I refuse to AoE. Does that mean I shouldn't be kicked? Of course not! I can do the same if all I do when tanking is Riot Blade + Flash. Same deal.

Clearing the content is NOT a good baseline, because you can get carried through damn near anything.

[Lium]

I'm familiar with it. And you can and should get kicked in a circumstances like that if you're not contributing still.

I can clear a dungeon just fine and nobody will die if I refuse to AoE. Does that mean I shouldn't be kicked? Of course not! I can do the same if all I do when tanking is Riot Blade + Flash. Same deal.

Clearing the content is NOT a good baseline, because you can get carried through damn near anything.

Then this sounds like a case of wanting speed clears. Which is perfectly fine, but is not vital to clearing content or progression. If you want to get through a leveling dungeon as fast as possible you can make your own group with like-minded players. You don't need a damage meter to know who's pulling their weight and who's not. There's only two DPS in regular dungeons. It not hard to figure out which one it is.

[dragonseth07]

Then this sounds like a case of wanting speed clears. Which is perfectly fine, but is not vital to clearing content or progression. If you want to get through a leveling dungeon as fast as possible you can make your own group with like-minded players. You don't need a damage meter to know who's pulling their weight and who's not. There's only two DPS in regular dungeons. It not hard to figure out which one it is.

You seem to have ignored my point. Either that, or it's okay to not try because we will clear in the end anyway.

[bardaboo]

Damage meters have never really brought anything good to a community, in my opinion. I can see them being helpful in elite content of some type where you need to make sure everyone is performing optimally. But usually what ends up happening is people start using them in leveling dungeons and as a way to either stroke their own epeen or grief other players.

Check out the WoW forums if you want to see horror stories about getting kicked from groups for low DPS even though they were clearing the dungeon just fine and nobody was dying.

Why must it only be hard content that we have to care and try? Wouldn't you like to know if you are doing half the damage as someone in expert roulette? If you were the tanking expert and the dps are putting out low numbers and the healer is just afk healing you, you could still beat the dungeon without dying, but it'll take 45 minutes. That cool with you? I wouldn't appreciate everyone's lack of effort.

[Lium]

Why must it only be hard content that we have to care and try? Wouldn't you like to know if you are doing half the damage as someone in expert roulette? If you were the tanking expert and the dps are putting out low numbers and the healer is just afk healing you, you could still beat the dungeon without dying, but it'll take 45 minutes. That cool with you? I wouldn't appreciate everyone's lack of effort.

Again, you don't need a damage meter to tell who's doing good and who's not.

[Dualgunner]

Again, you don't need a damage meter to tell who's doing good and who's not.

Don't need an aggro meter to tell what's aggroed to you or not. It just helps.

[bardaboo]

Again, you don't need a damage meter to tell who's doing good and who's not.

You're missing my point it sounded like you were saying players getting kicked for low dps is a direct result of parsers. And now you are refuting your own point?

[DGladius]

Again, you don't need a damage meter to tell who's doing good and who's not.

Without a parser, a run can still go smooth and at a good pace but you can get a scenario where DPS#1 averages 2400 dps the entire dungeon run and DPS#2 averages only 1000 with equivalent gear. Not everyone will know how each dps jobs is suppose to play and people probably aren't going to be paying much attention to what attack actions the dps players are doing during a run. So you can get 1 player who's half-assing it without consequence.

For raids, if things take too long to die which causes problems. The group can go 'wow you dps players aren't doing well enough.' But you can have 2 dps putting out very good numbers and the other 2 not that great. Can the group definitively know which dps aren't performing well enough? Was it all 4 dps that was bad or was it only 1 or 2? You'd have to put a lot of focus on each dps players and know the class to see if they are performing well enough or not during the raid, and then try and justify why this individual dps or more was not performing good enough without concrete proof.