Do Something About Duty Finder Already

[KokonoeAiyoko]

The only way the call-outs could be more apparent is if they were voiced but if your argument is that players are just tunnel-visioning too hard on the fight to pay attention then it wouldn't matter how obvious they made them because bad players would ignore them anyway.

It isn't the greatest line of reasoning.

Your entire argument is essentially saying bad players are bad because they're either tunneling too hard on the fight, panicking because of a giant dragon, or not communicating at all none of which can be blamed on the design of the content itself.

It's only design flaw (and it is a massive one) is that it takes so long for the fight to reset even though you can fail the win conditions long before it ever reaches the gate.

And Initially completed mine in DF group that beat it on our first queue on the day of its release.

Actually, my argument is that not that they are bad, but that they are new and being grouped with impatient people and they don't get enough time to learn. Most people expect to win in 1-3 attempts and sometimes that's not feasible. Steps of Faith is a very unique instance and it goes against a lot of how most of the game is designed. Players weren't prepared for such a drastic change, and adding it to the Roulette made it worse. You can't really expect things to go smoothly if out of nowhere for one fight you expect players to do all kinds of things that they never had to really do much before for most content.

[Ryel]

Actually, my argument is that not that they are bad, but that they are new and being grouped with impatient people and they don't get enough time to learn. Most people expect to win in 1-3 attempts and sometimes that's not feasible. Steps of Faith is a very unique instance and it goes against a lot of how most of the game is designed. Players weren't prepared for such a drastic change, and adding it to the Roulette made it worse. You can't really expect things to go smoothly if out of nowhere for one fight you expect players to do all kinds of things that they never had to really do much before for most content.

If I end up with Steps of Faith I go in with zero expectations, pop open a bag of popcorn, and ride it out for better or worse.

You're right that it's designed very differently compared to the vast majority of content which is also why I singled out it's uniqueness in being one of the very few pieces of content that literally walks you through it by giving you step by step directions.

If players aren't paying attention or are actively ignoring those directions that isn't the fault of the content or of the people who have completed the content prior.

1-3 FULL attempts of Steps of Faith (As in the dragon makes it to the wall) actually is pretty reasonable, in fact with the way the DPS check has been lowered you could probably kill it from half way as long as you hit it with the dragonkillers, which if experienced people are ending up in the party at least one of them should be able to do.

It's also a level 50 instance.

Say what you will about its mechanics but no mechanic in that fight is explicitly "new"; interacting with objects, using cannons or objects to kill enemies and AoEing down mobs etc have all made appearances in other instances and quests prior to that point. It's the combination of those mechanics and the layout of the instance that actually makes it unique.

I understand your point, truly I do so please don't think i'm being unsympathetic but the reasoning of "Players are new" or "being grouped with impatient people" can only go so far when the game itself is all but trying to complete that instance for you.

Like i said your point holds far more value when applied to like... Coil, Alexander, or Ex primals. All of which often throw players new to the content to the wolves because the mechanics are often very different or unique compared to other content and the fights are much more unclear with their directions and strategies when attempting blind.

This however does not apply to Steps of Faith.

[Lunafreya]

I'm sure putting your thread in caps would help SE notice. Great job.

[Mycow8me]

You seem to really not get the point of this thread...

I get the point of your thread, but SE should not have to hold their hand when they are playing an MMORPG. Players should socialize, look for improvement, find out what skills and abilities are available, expect to have to do certain class quests. Any number of tools available to them and there will always be people who are just in a hurry to endgame and not bothering enough to learn their role well or just dont care. If this is their first MMORPG then they obviously are going to have a high learning curve but no amount of guiding is going to help someone who doesn't seek the information themselves.

YES, if you want players your caliber, you should be expected to PF for dungeons or find friends to play with. You are arbitrarily trying to change a public system that was designed to help people find a group to do a dungeon with. If you are not willing to actively seek the players you want, then you have no right to complain.

[Iromi]

I think a mirror type fight would be a great idea. I remember doing that in FFXI..back when I did it there were no guides (2003 lol) and no other Summoners really! I ended up writing a guide for others and learning a lot about the game at the time.

[Khemorex]

the only thing that needs a change is the OP's attitude ^^

[Meraii]

Solution 3: After all those abilities ARE on hand...a trial that makes sure they know how to use them when and where

See, I wouldn't mind this. Not as a 'stop being a noob' type of thing but more, letting me see if I am doing it right. I've yet to tank in any duty finders because i'm paranoid i'll get it wrong so some more solo challenges that woujld give me practice would be great.
Then again, I guess that is what guildhests, the new adventurer solo duties and your leveling quests are for.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

I think skilled players that were queuing before will continue do so, because they are there for the bonuses rather than redo some piece of content they already know. If meet with leafs is an annoyance, it is the price to pay for bonuses.

As long as everyday I see countless threads about how duties are facerolls and healers can just go cleric fulltime, I'm quite sure those "leftovers" will complete them anyway.

Yes and no. Currently, tomestones are gifted like candy. As a raider, I usually capped within the first day. In fact, I ran Expert Roulette less than thirty times since 3.5 dropped what, six months ago?

If it reaches a point where the player skill gap is large enough, better players won't queue. I noticed the last few patches queue times have declined considerably. So that mindset may already be in motion. This isn't an elitist stance either; before anyone attempts to argue otherwise. People don't want to bother with groups who can't be bothered to learn the very basics of their job by max level.

[EorzeaHero69]

A compiled list refrences it: here
And there is an interview talking about it in interest: here

Will come back again when I can find where I read it first, which wasn't either of the two above. Just didn't want to say I'll look into it and not look into it at least a bit lol.

Cool thanks.

[Jpec07]

I'm amused that your TL;DR: section is longer than the rest of your post, OP.

I will say I can relate, though. I had a dungeon run last night with an FC mate in Baelsar's Wall with a SMN who didn't use Dreadwyrm Trance, and wouldn't use anything more than Bio when Tri-disaster was on cooldown (who also had Ifrit out on trash and switched to Garuda for the boss), and a BLM who was playing without Enochian. The first trash pull took five minutes, and we abandoned after wiping twice on the first boss. I've had a few such instances where we were paired with players who were either trolling, or who just didn't know what they were doing, and it's soured me some to the idea of queueing by myself.

Some kind of feedback system would be nice to let players know that they're not doing what they should be, but I'm not sure how they could implement something like that properly.