Is our sub fee not enought

[Kaedan]

Well basicaly, if you want to wear that dress

you are forced to buy it in the Mog Station cause no way to obtain it IG

Are you aware of what the words "forced" and "have to" mean?

You are not forced to buy anything from the mog store. No one is holding a gun to your head to buy things. WANTING things in the mog store and DECIDING to purchase them because you like them enough to buy them is not being "forced".

[Zojha]

Are you aware of what the words "forced" and "have to" mean?

Do you?

Here's a fun fact: You can only "force" somebody to do something by holding them at gunpoint if they "want" to live prior. If they want to die instead, you're not going to have any success with that method, they're happily gonna say:"No, eff you."

In order for Need to arise, there has to be a prior "Want". IF you want X, THEN you need/have to/are forced to do Y, because Y is necessary to get X. If you don't want X in the first place, you can screw Y.

[Seig345]

Do you?

Here's a fun fact: You can only "force" somebody to do something by holding them at gunpoint if they "want" to live prior. If they want to die instead, you're not going to have any success with that method, they're happily gonna say:"No, eff you."

In order for Need to arise, there has to be a prior "Want". IF you want X, THEN you need/have to/are forced to do Y, because Y is necessary to get X. If you don't want X in the first place, you can screw Y.

What about the "why" behind your "want"? Why do you want that thing, and is there nothing else in the world that will help you achieve the same thing than those specific things you want at this moment in your life? There are things in life you can't change, and learning to adjust your own wants and expectations regarding the things you can't change is going to lead to far less frustration in life.

Feel free to interpret that to mean you shouldn't complain about anything ever, though.

[Kaedan]

Here's a fun fact: You can only "force" somebody to do something by holding them at gunpoint if they "want" to live prior. If they want to die instead, you're not going to have any success with that method, they're happily gonna say:"No, eff you."

In order for Need to arise, there has to be a prior "Want". IF you want X, THEN you need/have to/are forced to do Y, because Y is necessary to get X. If you don't want X in the first place, you can screw Y.

Absolutely incorrect.

I don't want to work at one of my jobs... I have to. I need to.
I don't want to eat healthy foods because there are other less or non-healthy foods I'd rather eat... but I have to. I need to for my health.

There are many, many things that people don't want to do but they have to. They are forced to due to some consequence or another. You are not, in any way, forced to buy anything from the mogstation. If there is something that you want, then it's your conscious decision whether or not to buy it.

[Zojha]

There are many, many things that people don't want to do but they have to.

Yes, because they are tied to another thing that they do want. I just explained that to you in abstract terms.

Take your food example: The reason you are eating food you don't want is because you WANT to be healthy. You are not forced to be healthy. You just want to, because being healthy feels far better than being sick and you like being functional. And the only way to get that is to eat food you don't want to eat. Your Want to be healthy creates the Need to eat healthy food. If you don't want to be healthy in the first place, you can screw healthy food.
Same for your job. You do not have to have a job. You can refuse, get fired or jailed, have no income. You only need the income because you WANT to afford food because you WANT to live and you need food to live, so you need income as well. This all depends on your own WANT.

[ErikMynhier]

Are you aware of what the words "forced" and "have to" mean?

You are not forced to buy anything from the mog store. No one is holding a gun to your head to buy things. WANTING things in the mog store and DECIDING to purchase them because you like them enough to buy them is not being "forced".

Like Amma always said. "If you can't have what you want, change your wants." People these days are so spoiled by instant gratification they no longer can tell the difference between "want" and "need" so they treat both ideas the same.

If they said "you can only eat raid XYZ with this item from our cash shop", sure I could get the argument. People getting all enraged over glamour items and fun stuff being CS only so the company can turn a profit, I just think that's incredibly entitled, spoiled, and first-world.

[Alleo]

If they said "you can only eat raid XYZ with this item from our cash shop", sure I could get the argument. People getting all enraged over glamour items and fun stuff being CS only so the company can turn a profit, I just think that's incredibly entitled, spoiled, and first-world.

And why exactly is a raid item in the cash shop much different than emotes, mounts or pets? Why does only the raid point deserve enrage? All of them are content..I dont care for raids for example, lots of people dont care for raids since only a really small amount of people clear it anyway. Yet it costs a lot of money and time to create. (Bosses, equipment and so on) The majority of people in this game are probably casual, care for pets, glamour and other parts and thus it would probably only hit a small amount of people if they would do that. Why are those small numbers of people more entitled to have their raid ingame? They dont need the raid to play this game. Crying about this eventhough the company would earn money from that which would be better for their costs of creating such content and at the same time might leave more time and money to create more content for the majority of the players..well quite spoiled I would say.

See you can turn every argument around. Some people need to understand that glamour is content too..Ex primals are run a lot of times because of the mounts that drop or because you can create some nice items from the drops. Without the glamour and mount as an incentive people would not run these old primals the same way they do with them..so all these glamour items are really important to keep content active. Barely anyone would run Garuda ex if there is nothing behind the first win. All these pets, mounts and glamour could have been put into the game. They could have been used to keep older content alive or even create new content.

Yes nobody is truly forced to buy something, but in this way wouldn't it be completely acceptable if they put every new glamour in there and only get us re-skinned new equipment in the game? Since you dont need glamour to beat a dungeon.

[ErikMynhier]

And why exactly is a raid item in the cash shop much different than emotes, mounts or pets? Why does only the raid point deserve enrage? All of them are content..I dont care for raids for example, lots of people dont care for raids since only a really small amount of people clear it anyway. Yet it costs a lot of money and time to create. (Bosses, equipment and so on) The majority of people in this game are probably casual, care for pets, glamour and other parts and thus it would probably only hit a small amount of people if they would do that. Why are those small numbers of people more entitled to have their raid ingame? They dont need the raid to play this game. Crying about this eventhough the company would earn money from that which would be better for their costs of creating such content and at the same time might leave more time and money to create more content for the majority of the players..well quite spoiled I would say.

See you can turn every argument around. Some people need to understand that glamour is content too..Ex primals are run a lot of times because of the mounts that drop or because you can create some nice items from the drops. Without the glamour and mount as an incentive people would not run these old primals the same way they do with them..so all these glamour items are really important to keep content active. Barely anyone would run Garuda ex if there is nothing behind the first win. All these pets, mounts and glamour could have been put into the game. They could have been used to keep older content alive or even create new content.

Yes nobody is truly forced to buy something, but in this way wouldn't it be completely acceptable if they put every new glamour in there and only get us re-skinned new equipment in the game? Since you dont need glamour to beat a dungeon.

As a glamour gobbling Balmung player, I have to respectfully disagree. You do not need a glam to win the game, it is different. Let me show you how I see it, maybe that will help you understand where I am coming from.

I work in the death trade, mortuaries. Now when you die your body has to be dealt with, that's the law, let's call that the basic sub. So with no frills everyone at the start of things (for their sub) gets the basic of the basic service ok. But some want glamour, for a fancy funeral to impress friends and enemies is their "end game". Now you don't need that, legally we can put anyone in the ground for a flat fee, the same fee. But if you want something.... demand it, should my company not provide it? Or provide it and eat the cost? No, of course not. If you want Saudi desert roses, you bet your tail I'll find some and as any business would, charge accordingly. Is that a cash grab? To provide extra services or extra cost that have been requested by my customers? No, its business, and honestly insane to expect that extra stuff beyond the basic package to be free. It's insane, the signatures I see, the posts, all going on about how SE should make everything free, to put everything in their game and just say f-profit.


Its not a White Knight issue, its a business person's issue. It makes me wonder how many of the people who complain against the CS understand how business work. The /playdead has been requested for years, my history will show at least 6-10 posts asking for it. So as a business I can see the meeting going, "We are between patches, revenue is down a little. Options?" To which someone would say, "Lots of request for /playdead." Someone gets put on the project, takes a few weeks IDK programing, but I do know the lad/lady working on it got paid, has insurance, most likely got overtime in an office with lights, internet, plumbing, all things that are not free (ie, overhead). No that stuff is not already there, someone on a small team is put on something like that its most likely an extra project meaning overtime and resources added like lights on at night to allow for work.

So true we don't know where the money goes in detail but with a little thought it is not hard to sort out that the emote was not free to make. We have to pay extra for extra things. If you want exotic flowers at your funeral you need to pay me extra. If you want an extra ranch sauce from McDonalds you have to pay extra. If you want better seats on your flight you need to pay extra. Extra money for extra stuff, how is this new to anyone?

[Stormrider]

Its not a White Knight issue, its a business person's issue. It makes me wonder how many of the people who complain against the CS understand how business work.

With a certain level of transparency and up front pricing structure. SE is a business and they can price how ever they want. But other types of business have to obey laws and be up front about costs and services. We have definitely not seen that. They are making the rules as they go. Just because you make money doesn't entitle you to do as you please. It seems most defense is it's a business so its ok they can do what ever.

If they came out and said, "We are only going to give you basic services with the odd extra. We plan to regionalise gear and then charge on top. All cash shop will be per character and never per account." You can live with that and people should shut up. But that is not what is happening.

[ErikMynhier]

With a certain level of transparency and up front pricing structure. SE is a business and they can price how ever they want. But other types of business have to obey laws and be up front about costs and services. We have definitely not seen that. They are making the rules as they go. Just because you make money doesn't entitle you to do as you please. It seems most defense is it's a business so its ok they can do what ever.

If they came out and said, "We are only going to give you basic services with the odd extra. We plan to regionalise gear and then charge on top. All cash shop will be per character and never per account." You can live with that and people should shut up. But that is not what is happening.

Do you ask for financial transparency from any other business you get extra things from? The example I give with McDonalds, the extra sauce, some McDs will charge for it. Critical thinking can break down, without statements of finance, that we pay extra as it dips into stocks that have to be bought or replenished. Its logical thought.

Now I will meet you halfway on the issues of price. Sometimes the price is to high, and without records we can't know how high is to high. So instead of getting all heated, let's get some people in the community to crunch the numbers, something MMO players are very good at. Let's find the average cost of wages, how many people would likely be needed, other costs. Let's try and break down the cost of FFXIV and see if some are correct about the price or if its an over reaction.

I feel a cash shop is fine, and that it IS the place for extra items with no baring on the game. But instead of this endless nonsense maybe we should take it upon ourselves to find an answer. I would be happy to help in such a project.