DPS obsession in farm groups

[Texa]

it does seem to have gotten a little bit weird recently though when even seph ex bird farms are being set up with i265+ requirements. which basically excludes anyone who doesn't do savage. if you don't do savage the best your likely to be is 264 (based on my pld) pretty sure I haven't missed any weeklys from dun scaith or upgrades...

That reminds me I ran into someone who was very aggressively talking down on me for having lower dps than they did in a gubal hard mode lore farm.

Their dps was great! They had a 275 alex weapon! But oh my gosh it's a lore farm. He kept begging the party for compliments and then got all "i know my dps was better than a mediocre smn" and I just left at that point.

A big reason that I haven't been running savage is because attitudes like that wear me out. It seems like a lot of them are getting bored with a9s-a12s now and bleeding out into every mundane thing in ff xiv instead of just playing a different game for a while.

[CookieMonsta]

That reminds me I ran into someone who was very aggressively talking down on me for having lower dps than they did in a gubal hard mode lore farm.

Their dps was great! They had a 275 alex weapon! But oh my gosh it's a lore farm. He kept begging the party for compliments and then got all "i know my dps was better than a mediocre smn" and I just left at that point.

A big reason that I haven't been running savage is because attitudes like that wear me out. It seems like a lot of them are getting bored with a9s-a12s now and bleeding out into every mundane thing in ff xiv instead of just playing a different game for a while.

Did you AoE the adds appropriately? Everyone expects SMN to be top DPS when there are 3 or more adds because of Tri-disaster + Bane + Deathflare. Its nothing to do with the weapon, you can still parse highest with 240 gear. While I admit, that particular fool was a dick but it doesn't mean you shouldn't examine your own plays.

You're surprised people want to farm something fast?, more deeps means faster clears and fast clears mean more chance at getting a bird drop.

There are so many luddites on this thread we may as well not bother.

[Texa]

Did you AoE the adds appropriately? Everyone expects SMN to be top DPS when there are 3 or more adds because of Tri-disaster + Bane + Deathflare. Its nothing to do with the weapon, you can still parse highest with 240 gear. While I admit, that particular fool was a dick but it doesn't mean you shouldn't examine your own plays.

Of course I did, I main SMN and I have a 2000-2100 average in gubal usually. My runs there typically take about 12 minutes. That dude was mad the party lead asked for 2 ranged in in the pf when he wanted to run on monk.

My parse is lower in Zurvan because I time my rotation so that I can burn as much as I possibly can when I know I won't have to run around for a lot of mechanics or when he's about the jump off the field. This will leave me with very little mp until I have another aether stack to mp drain through before adds and the second soar though, equaling a decent amount of time of me relying on Garuda for damage. This is also not account for times I run out of mp res-ing other party members to avoid a wipe. So generally people who don't know my strategy there will just look at the parse and see the lower overall end-fight average and think I'm playing bad.

[Welsper59]

You're surprised people want to farm something fast?, more deeps means faster clears and fast clears mean more chance at getting a bird drop.

There are so many luddites on this thread we may as well not bother.

Always a sad state of affairs when people defend ridiculous and hostile complaints about a difference of a few minutes to a fights clear time, even if that means having to put a bit more effort into a mindless routine. Your time is not as important as you think it is if you're wasting it being on this forum or playing the game.

[ToasterMan]

Always a sad state of affairs when people defend ridiculous and hostile complaints about a difference of a few minutes to a fights clear time, even if that means having to put a bit more effort into a mindless routine. Your time is not as important as you think it is if you're wasting it being on this forum or playing the game.

Yup, there's a bunch of people on this forum that act like it's a crime if you cause them to spend an extra couple of minutes in a dungeon. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad. Some of them try to guilt trip you for it too, like I'm ACTUALLY suppose to feel sorry for them for spending an extra couple of minutes doing expert. Seriously, give me a break.

I think this DPS meta is a big problem and I hope SE does something about it come the next expansion. I mean, I know DPS is important, but it's gotten out of control. Offense should not be the only thing the game emphasizes.

[CookieMonsta]

Yup, there's a bunch of people on this forum that act like it's a crime if you cause them to spend an extra couple of minutes in a dungeon. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad. Some of them try to guilt trip you for it too. Like I'm suppose to feel sorry for them for spending an extra couple of minutes doing expert.

You misunderstand, its not a crime to take minutes longer to finish a dungeon. Its a crime to not give a shit about trying then trying to justify it.

[ElHeggunte]

Always a sad state of affairs when people defend ridiculous and hostile complaints about a difference of a few minutes to a fights clear time, even if that means having to put a bit more effort into a mindless routine. Your time is not as important as you think it is if you're wasting it being on this forum or playing the game.

Yup, there's a bunch of people on this forum that act like it's a crime if you cause them to spend an extra couple of minutes in a dungeon. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

The problem is those "few extra minutes" add up. If you're clearing a 6-minute fight in 8 minutes, after only three runs those extra two minutes would have equaled an entire extra run that you're now missing out on. And it only gets worse the longer you farm.

I don't agree with being openly hostile over a few extra minutes, but I also don't understand the mindset of people who think wanting to be efficient is a bad thing. To me, it's encouraging mediocrity if you're fine with tagging several extra minutes onto each fight because someone is sandbagging. Doesn't matter what the content is.

But for some reason this community seems to love wanting to give DDs a free pass for a poor performance. A tank can't hold threat or dies to mechanics because they wont use CDs? He's bad, replace him. A healer can't keep people alive? He's terrible, get him outta here! A DD is limp-wristing so hard that you're taking longer than you should to clear fights or are forced to deal with extra mechanics? Shut up and leave him alone, not everyone wants to speed-run. No.

[thegreatonemal]

The problem is those "few extra minutes" add up. If you're clearing a 6-minute fight in 8 minutes, after only three runs those extra two minutes would have equaled an entire extra run that you're now missing out on. And it only gets worse the longer you farm.



But for some reason this community seems to love wanting to give DDs a free pass for a poor performance. A tank can't hold threat or dies to mechanics because they wont use CDs? He's bad, replace him. A healer can't keep people alive? He's terrible, get him outta here! A DD is limp-wristing so hard that you're taking longer than you should to clear fights or are forced to deal with extra mechanics? Shut up and leave him alone, not everyone wants to speed-run. No.

Because as far as DPS goes how you rate bad performance is different for everyone its easy to point it out for healers and tanks because everyone tends to die after they mess up.

[ToasterMan]

The problem is those "few extra minutes" add up. If you're clearing a 6-minute fight in 8 minutes, after only three runs those extra two minutes would have equaled an entire extra run that you're now missing out on. And it only gets worse the longer you farm.

I don't agree with being openly hostile over a few extra minutes, but I also don't understand the mindset of people who think wanting to be efficient is a bad thing. To me, it's encouraging mediocrity if you're fine with tagging several extra minutes onto each fight because someone is sandbagging. Doesn't matter what the content is.

But for some reason this community seems to love wanting to give DDs a free pass for a poor performance. A tank can't hold threat or dies to mechanics because they wont use CDs? He's bad, replace him. A healer can't keep people alive? He's terrible, get him outta here! A DD is limp-wristing so hard that you're taking longer than you should to clear fights or are forced to deal with extra mechanics? Shut up and leave him alone, not everyone wants to speed-run. No.

I'm not encouraging people to not try and be efficient. I do the best I can whenever I go into an instance. As a healer main that means dpsing and all that when I can, but at the same time I know some healers aren't as comfortable with being all out battle mage. I'd rather not wipe because the healer went into cleric stance at the wrong time causing the tank to die. (Even though that's probably only a real danger in relevant raid content.

You misunderstand, its not a crime to take minutes longer to finish a dungeon. Its a crime to not give a shit about trying then trying to justify it.

Just because someone doesn't meet someone's expectations doesn't mean they aren't trying, or don't care about trying, but I think that's what some people in this community honestly believe. It's not that black and white.

[JunseiKei]

Just because someone doesn't meet someone's expectations doesn't mean they aren't trying, or don't care about trying, but I think that's what some people in this community honestly believe. It's not that black and white.

When paired with the comment they are speaking to, you'll see where it applies. People genuinely think it's alright to play sub-par; I actually had this conversation with an FC mate, admitting he purposely slacks off in places like 24 man raids because, "there's 23 other people. It's not going to matter if I just use the same combo over and over."

People don't seem to get that playing poorly and sub-optimally frequently builds muscle memory and retention of undesired habits. Coupled with the fact that unless the DPS is so blatantly bad that you can easily spot the source of the issue, it goes unnoticed and passed off; or noticed, but unable to confirm where. Unless you use a parser, of course, which is against ToS. I suppose SE could go about adding hard enrages that have much stricter DPS checks to make a point. At the same token, as much as I'd love that issue to be pushed as a, "You see?" statement, I don't want the game to be a ghost town because people would rather whine, threaten to quit (or actually quit). Exhibit A: Gordias Savage and the raiding community; Exhibit B: Steps of Faith before nerf to hell and back for the MSQ and general player base.

Oddly enough, building such habits often leads one to think it's okay, even if passively, to play badly. Then when you need to play well, you won't; you've built up the habit to perform poorly. Then when others see those that push DPS, or trying to form good habits all the time, they are labeled as "try-hards." That is something my husband actually gets flack for all the time; he hates playing badly and does everything in his ability to do as much DPS as possible in all situations. This does not just apply in FFXIV- For Honor, Tekken, Street Fighter, King of Fighers, Dark Souls, Monster Hunter. The same principle is there.