@Naoki Yoshida-> Make Samurai a Tank class!

[bounddreamer]

Why do people assume Dragoons use Spears?

http://www.ffxivinfo.com/items/dragoon.php

Not going to count how many of their official weapons names are "spear" but it's safe to say "a lot" if not "most."

[shao32]

well i hope in 4-5 days they show us if SAM go to come or at least how many jobs and what roles come on 4.0, lets be patients ppl ^^

[GMERC]

http://www.ffxivinfo.com/items/dragoon.php

Not going to count how many of their official weapons names are "spear" but it's safe to say "a lot" if not "most."

[Shippuu]

"SEE THESE MINUSCULE SHIFTS IN NUMBERS, THAT MEANS YOU WERE, LIKE, SO WRONG!"

Well, golly gee, 2%, that's almost half the number of people who bothered to play endgame! You're right, cause there couldn't be any possibility that people decided DRK was something they could finally enjoy tanking with, but of course we're not going specify what are current and what are new players, that's obviously not a stat we'd want to know.

2% is hardly a number to scoff at, even if you lowball the current active subscribers to be around 200,000, that's still 4,000 new tanks. If you go closer to what the likely actual number is in 500,000 active subscribers, that's 10,000.

And the popularity doubling since last year... when it released in June... before QoL updates... and people getting a feel for the job... over a period of time when a main can get stale for a player often pushing them to try other roles/classes. Let's not worry about what makes the difference though, it said from previous year to current so that's what is important.

Unfortunately SE botched their graph for this year, and upon looking at it after sleep, the 47% being Dark Knight's is actually more likely meant to be 37%. So not quite doubled, but still significant.
The difference is a bit irrelevant however, especially when very few quality of life changes have been made to things like Dark Knight specifically. On top of the fact that it's widely accepted the best tank in the game is undoubtedly Warrior, yet it's not the most popular tank, means that Dark Knight, through gameplay/appeal/etc. worked as an addition to the tank pool. A "main getting stale" resulting in people trying/leveling tank jobs is still a positive gain, regardless if it's a delayed one, this means it has an actual long term beneficial effect.

The numbers still went up, which is the opposite of the trend from 2014-2015, where tank population dropped from 21% to 19%. It's now back up to 21%. It's a very common argument in these threads that "Adding new tanks won't increase the tank population." Which looking at this information can clearly be seen as untrue.

Oh, but someone might have said that there was no possible way people would try DRK? Not like it'd make sense that obviously some people are going to try AND like DRK and make a shift in occupation. But you got some fancy numbers to throw around, so who cares about those pesky finer details?

It's simply quantifiable evidence in response to people who plug their ears and ignore common sense. Of course people who haven't tanked would try AND like DRK, I've been saying it forever, it's the naysayers who come in and say "It's not increasing tank numbers, NOPE, only existing tank players play tank jobs." This is somewhat solid proof from SE that they're wrong.

[Thunda_Cat_SMASH]

I still don't see how RDM could possibly work as anything other than a tank. There's literally only one role in the game that can be considered a 'jack-of-all-trades' type of role, and that would be tanks. Tanks can heal, buff, DPS, mitigate, and literally everything in between. RDM as any other role would literally just spit in the face of their identity.

[JunseiKei]

I still don't see how RDM could possibly work as anything other than a tank. There's literally only one role in the game that can be considered a 'jack-of-all-trades' type of role, and that would be tanks. Tanks can heal, buff, DPS, mitigate, and literally everything in between. RDM as any other role would literally just spit in the face of their identity.

Probably from the poll way back when?

(Click the image to be taken to the poll.)

[Shippuu]

i wouldn't say a 2% gain in tanks is any proof that DRK lures people to try tanking. i mean: i tried tanking because of DRK, so stuff like this happens. but a 2% gain in tanks over a year? that's not really "luring people". what these numbers show is that many PLD switched to DRK, that's it.

Still doesn't change the fact Tank numbers went up, compared to their previous downward trend from 2014-2015 where they dropped from 21% to 19%. They're now back up to 21%. And going by their level 60 job breakdown, tanks make up 23% of level 60's, so even more. Also, looking at the job distribution chart for 2016, even if it's just level 60 jobs, we can see that while yes, PLD numbers went down, they didn't make up the full increase in DRK numbers, there was still an additional 1% in WAR and 1% in DRK. You can't say only PLD switched to DRK, as some WAR could switch to DRK, and some PLD could switch to WAR. We don't have any data for that so you can't make a blanket statement like that in any kind of substantial manner.

[Shippuu]

I still don't see how RDM could possibly work as anything other than a tank. There's literally only one role in the game that can be considered a 'jack-of-all-trades' type of role, and that would be tanks. Tanks can heal, buff, DPS, mitigate, and literally everything in between. RDM as any other role would literally just spit in the face of their identity.

Except tanks still excel in one area, they aren't a "jack of all trades, master of none". They're masters at mitigating damage, which RDM has never been known for but certainly has tools to do it in past games (Phalanx etc.). Healers in FFXIV can heal, dps, buff, and mitigate as well. So can DPS. Warrior's and Dark Knight's only have self-heals, just like many DPS can bring Second Wind. Only PLD can heal others. One could also argue Mantra bonus healing can be attributed towards the DPS job who put it out (5% bonus for BRD, NIN, DRG while 20% bonus for MNK). It can also be argued that BRD/MCH/NIN's ability to regenerate TP/MP for others is technically a form of 'healing' as well, it's simply healing a different resource that isn't HP.

So you're wrong. The truth is, Red Mage could fit into any of the 3 roles, because pretty much every job in this game is a general "jack of all trades", they can all do damage, buff, debuff, mitigate, and heal to a degree.

[Duelle]

I still don't see how RDM could possibly work as anything other than a tank. There's literally only one role in the game that can be considered a 'jack-of-all-trades' type of role, and that would be tanks. Tanks can heal, buff, DPS, mitigate, and literally everything in between. RDM as any other role would literally just spit in the face of their identity.

Only if you want them to be generalists (which have no place in this game). Also this.

[Walfan]

Blue Mage as anything but a caster betrays its identity pretty hard.

Kimahri is a blue mage and is a close-range warrior using a spear. Their core identity is using monster abilities, not cast times.

Ya it is more about getting players to play a Tank in Group content instead of only playing it in non-group content. You can have a entire Map of Players playing SAM Tank or Dark Knight Tank and if you ask all of them, while some how get all of them to answer the question, how many of them even play that Tank Job in group content then majority would probably say they don't bother with Group content, dungeons and etc, which is why they level their Tank Job in easy non-group required contents such as mindlessly grinding FATEs.

100 players.
10 play tank.
SAM is released as a tank, 10 players start playing it, 5 of those in actual group content.
We now have 15 tank players.
I fail to see how the 5 other players who only want to look cool in hubs and stuff are in any way relevant.
Unless you think leveling the job is enough to count you amongst tank players ? So what are the players who level all jobs but only play one role in group content ?
I have SMN leveled but I'm not going to gear it first nor do I play it in high-end content. Am I a dps player ?
I mean, if some people aren't even going to play the job in group content, the only place where job roles matter, you shouldn't count them as tank but as the roles they actually play.
Like seriously I still don't comprehend your logic here and how it's a good argument against the fact popular jobs can make people try tanks.

Community wise SAM will have outcry, just because it has been a popular request since even 1.0 to have a SAM DPS job.

Most people play dps + SAM is a very popular job = most people will be angry they don't get the toy they wanted.
How is it in any way surprising ? Tanks are a minority but does it mean they shouldn't get nice toys when the dps want them too? Do only the dps deserve it because they are more of them ? Do us tanks only get the leftovers ?
Anyone bringing up stuff like the number of likes this thread got as if it's in any way relevant needs to learn what logic and fairness are before they post.

EDIT : Even if you really want to bring it up, by using the number of likes of the first two posts in this thread you can see around 20% are in favor of SAM tank, almost exactly the % of tank players.
"So if it's the same number how is SAM tank going to help ?" Flawed logic again. If people want SAM as a dps they will support it as a dps, only then if it's released as a tank may they be willing to try it as a tank.