DPS requirements to unlock duties?

[lulunami]

When Nidhogg Story mode was released, it took me 12 hours to beat it in Duty Finder. While running trial roulette the first two weeks of the patch, I had a 10 percent success rate in Nidhogg Story mode because we failed to beat the 3 add DPS check. We either vote abandoned or failed after an hour of trying.

Considering I was able to beat the A8S SSS striking dummy at ilvl 220 with a Sephirot weapon, Nidhogg Story mode was too hard to carry newbies in Duty Finder. I understand there are a lot of new players that do not know how to play. Doing complex rotations takes dedication and practice. I do not think I ever experienced anything more depressing in Duty Finder. I just hope these DPS players learned how to play properly.

[StrejdaTom]

I just hope these DPS players learned how to play properly.

Why would they? There is 0 incentive to get better in this game and every time someone suggests something that would force people to care atleast a bit about their job it gets shot down immediately. Not sure why it is so hard to understand that for other players this game is supposed to be fun too and not an unpaid job. And unfortunately this game ends up being unpaid job every time you are carrying x other people in DF because they "would rather leave the game than go to a dummy and learn something."

And I am not sure what is the point of SSS when the people who need it the most have no idea it is even in the game considering how optional it is. Well, my FC uses it when giving ranks to new people and deciding who we will help with extreme primals etc. (to make sure everyone deserves the help and isn't just being carried) but that's about it.

[Imoen]

Imoen have you ever even done the Stone Sea and Sky test? Like any of them? The way you speak makes it seem like you haven't or even done a lot of hard content in pugs. You seem so against it and your entire argument comes down to "but it wouldn't be fun" I've sttated several ways on how this could help out and yet you disregard all of it with non answers and misdirections

Depends on what you mean by, "hard"? Coil? Alex Savage? EX? Then ya I have. (not the latest iteration mind you, not going to lie, as I already said I have been out a while)

With all due respect, no I haven't seen you suggest any "several" ways on how this could help. I even went back and read all your posts when I read this. (thought I may have missed something)

What I read, boiled down to... "DPS hard check for n00bs" = "Save veterans time and headache"

If I missed some nuance in there, then I implore you to re-iterate, because I don't see it. Not trying to be difficult or any of those negative things, swirling in peoples brains. I'm just being critical, no different than anyone else being critical of other players that they shamelessly post about on these forums as if they are private or something, as if others can't read it. No different than players being critical of game content. This is the same thing.

I don't see how this helps, you haven't explained how this helps, except a perfect world scenario which would never exists even with this system.

I'm pointing out that ...

A. The system doesn't promote better play, it just teaches people how to do that "one" thing. No different than any other fight in the game

B. It is fundamentally boring from the perspective of someone first joining end game or the game in general. (could easily push people away from playing, if the moogle quests in churning mists didn't, like it or not, veterans quit out/get bored, new players are needed/wanted, don't push them away with snooze dummies.)

C. Even if the system existed, it would not solve what you are trying to solve. (Which from what I gather is, less headache on your end, and again I like to assume everyone is a good person just trying to help others) People are people, they make choices, no amount of game play design hand holding, will fix that.

/rant, people on here say "oh we want less hand holding" "oh we want more random" "we want harder stuff" well you know what? It can't happen, when random happens "oh random sux" when hard happens "oh its too hard" when less hand holding occures "we need more hand holding for people" ... honestly I don't think you all know what any of you all want.

[Rongway]

Lulz. I know at least 7 people that would drop this game so fast if they had to beat on a Dummy first. Like do you want to beat on a dummy? Nah me either. Cmon man what do you expect? People want the fight, not the dummy. I'm not saying people are ready ...but that is the rational going on.

You don't want to be compelled to blow up a thing that just sits there doing nothing before you get to fight the real thing that does the things and all that. But

If you can't beat a static dps check on a dummy you definitely shouldn't be queueing for whatever dungeon/trial that dummy is based on, because you either don't have enough gear or you don't know how to play your job.

is so right. If you can't beat a basic damage check on a stationary object that doesn't fight back, there is absolutely no way you can legitimately beat a damage check on a moving object that can kill you inside of two shots.

I am all for teaching people how to handle the mechanics in fights to which they are new. When they're ready. But in no reasonable scenario is someone going to put out more damage while dancing around floor patterns trying to stay alive than he would against a stationary, inactive, dummy. If someone goes into a fight lacking the gear or technique that a dummy expects him to have, he is asking for a bad time and condemning seven other people to the same.

It's not about

What I read, boiled down to... "DPS hard check for n00bs" = "Save veterans time and headache"

If there are seven or eight new people and only six of them have the gear and technical foundation upon which to heap the stress of mechanics and fine ability alignment, the one or two people who already can't meet the kill requirements against the easiest possible setup will prevent the prepared people from ever even seeing the later phases of the fight.

Which brings us back to

Lulz. I know at least 7 people that would drop this game so fast if they had to beat on a Dummy first. Like do you want to beat on a dummy? Nah me either. Cmon man what do you expect? People want the fight, not the dummy. I'm not saying people are ready ...but that is the rational going on.

only now it's not about the one person who doesn't want to lulz beat on a dummy before he has to mechanics. Because clearly, if the person in question can't blow up a dummy, he won't get to see very many mechanics anyway, and the worst part is that neither will the other seven people who are ready to kick some ass and don't think it's a lulzing matter.

[Imoen]

snip

I'm not disputing DPS checks, however; they already exist, we don't need dummies for that, and we already have dummies. So to be clear, are you supporting a full Dummy check on anything you enter? I can't be the only person on the planet that thinks that sounds like the most lame thing ever.

"Here play this chess game before you can play a chess game to see if you can play chess... ok now you can play chess, by the way, the other chess guys, well.... we thought they could play chess, but they really can't..... they just did really well during the warm up rounds."

Lets break this down, ok... seriously

I beat on dummy, win... "YAY, I can do a fight"

/goes on new job that I play...... not often

"Sorry guys, never done this on tank/melee/caster/heals"

You see the problem here? Do I do this stupid dummy for every single job? or is my single competence check on one job enough to support unlocking it for all? Now we do this times how many fights? Raids? Primals? ... do we go as far as dungeons, or is that ok cuz its casual? Another thread suggests it is not... "Better bring that A game"

People can dance around it all they want, this is what ilvl req is for. You SHOULD be able to beat content... best rotations? Maybe not... but this dummy thing doesn't prove anything either. All it does is prove that you were able to beat on something for a few seconds, no matter how you got there, to get good DPS. It doesn't automatically mean that people will continue, or even meet the dps checks still.. it is just a useless barrier that does nothing, and places everyone right in the position to complain about that system not being "good enough"



I would much rather place my weight behind a complete clone of the fight as a "practice" where you could pick "phases" to work on.

That could be DPS checks, heal checks, tank buster mechanic moments etc... w/e ... dummy though? Thumbs down.