Pally Is Almost Perfect

[eagledorf]

PLD and DRK are both far from almost perfect. Let's look at what's still weak about each job and think about if it's a problem or not.

PLD:

1. Runs out of TP the fastest of the tanks
2. Weakest debuff with the highest cost to apply
3. Lacking in magical buffs
4. Low DPS, no burst
5. Support spells still cancel
6. No AoE on GCD

DRK:

1. Lacking in reliable physical buffs
2. DPS, self-healing, support all dependent on taking damage frequently
3. Highest penalty for hate generation

For PLD:

1. Extremely problematic because Paladins require TP for all their damage-dealing skills and ranged hate-generating skill; PLD is also the only tank that requires TP to stun.
2. PLD is the only tank that can't debuff both damage types and Halone is the most expensive of the debuff skills to keep up.
3. Mainly problematic when compared to WAR, would be less so if Stoneskin couldn't cancel and no. 2 was fixed IMO.
4. Extremely problematic despite the tank DPS nerf. Low burst also means low burst hate and even lower DPS in actual content.
5. This is mostly problematic because of numbers 2-4, otherwise it's fine if they're basically OT only skills.
6. This is problematic because on a trash pull a PLD stops contributing anything after Blind resist sets in (~10s). There should be an AoE skill that can be spammed, but too expensive to be sustained like a DRK can sustain Unleash so PLD have to still mix in Flashes or heals.

DRK:

1. This is mainly problematic compared to WAR. SE has kept magic damage a fair part of raid content so it's not a disadvantage compared to PLD.
2. This is problematic because DRK will either perform poorly as OT or be overpowered as MT for as long as this remains the case. I also think it's not a logical design for a tank, but that's a matter of opinion.
3. This is problematic mainly in comparison to WAR.

Other comments:

1. I personally think Divine Veil should also proc on "absorb" heals as well as spells. Right now the fairy can proc Divine Veil, but Synastry cannot and this would fix this problem. As a bonus, casting Clemency on a third party would also proc it with this change.

2. Dark Dance and Bulwark are way under-powered compared to Raw Intuition. They're not only unreliable, they also have a weaker average efficacy.

[Synestra]

2. Dark Dance and Bulwark are way under-powered compared to Raw Intuition. They're not only unreliable, they also have a weaker average efficacy.

Also could anyone explain why Bulwark has 180s recast while being 60% chance while DD is same 60% with way shorther recast? is it because block is potentially stronger than parry? Also Bulwark is pretty damn weaksauce and unreliable for bosses, atm it feels more like filler CD for singletarget fights.

[SpookyGhost]

is it because block is potentially stronger than parry?

Probably. Also probably why Sheltron is one block only.

[eagledorf]

Also could anyone explain why Bulwark has 180s recast while being 60% chance while DD is same 60% with way shorther recast? is it because block is potentially stronger than parry? Also Bulwark is pretty damn weaksauce and unreliable for bosses, atm it feels more like filler CD for singletarget fights.

Uh, probably because Dark Dance is 30% (Unless I missed a change at some point)

[Synestra]

Uh, probably because Dark Dance is 30% (Unless I missed a change at some point)

Aww shit my bad, remebered it wrong. But still i would like to see slight reduce on Blulwarks CD maybe 150 or 120 so you can always combine it with Awarness+Foresight, but if thats too much then they could reduce block % to 50% to compensate CD reduction. Also i would like to see Tempered Will as an 90-120s CD as its already pretty situational, its awesome when it works, makes add picking easier in last phase of seph ex for example.

[eagledorf]

Aww shit my bad, remebered it wrong. But still i would like to see slight reduce on Blulwarks CD maybe 150 or 120 so you can always combine it with Awarness+Foresight, but if thats too much then they could reduce block % to 50% to compensate CD reduction. Also i would like to see Tempered Will as an 90-120s CD as its already pretty situational, its awesome when it works, makes add picking easier in last phase of seph ex for example.

For Bulwark to be balanced with Raw Intuition, it should probably have a 90s recast considering it also has a shorter duration and doesn't give a bonus perk like RI gives Wrath (on top of, you know, being random). Then of course Dark Dance needs a buff to match, maybe increased to a 40% parry rate or even higher. That's crazy obviously; they should nerf Raw Intuition, but I doubt the devs have the courage to do it so we'll end up with something bizarre one way or the other (unbalanced like we have now, or stupid like a 50% parry buff up 1/3 of the time).

[Violette]

Also could anyone explain why Bulwark has 180s recast while being 60% chance while DD is same 60% with way shorther recast? is it because block is potentially stronger than parry? Also Bulwark is pretty damn weaksauce and unreliable for bosses, atm it feels more like filler CD for singletarget fights.

At the moment we're seeing blocks up to 33%? Might be lower after every pld moved to vit acc, but 33%+60% block rate on top of the already good block rate (so we're talking 70%upwards block minimum), means it's a viable defense against multi-hit physical tank busters.

Dark Dance is only a 30% chance increase to something with 20% damage reduction (and a low 7-8% base), which can have 20% evasion added on top (not good), meaning for physical multi-hit tank busters DRK's have to burn Shadowskin/Shadow Wall instead of say, bulwark.

Also because the dev's hate plds.

[Synestra]

At the moment we're seeing blocks up to 33%?

Depends if its kite or tower shield, with thordans tower shield blocks were 28-29% and with kite it was around 23-24%. Both Bulwark and Shelltron are actually pretty good with towers as they have less block rate than kites, so you kinda gain more out from those skills when using tower shields.

[SpookyGhost]

Might be lower after every pld moved to vit acc

STR stopped affecting block/parry in 3.0. It's purely block rate/block strength on the shield now.

[Lyth]

Also could anyone explain why Bulwark has 180s recast while being 60% chance while DD is same 60% with way shorther recast? is it because block is potentially stronger than parry? Also Bulwark is pretty damn weaksauce and unreliable for bosses, atm it feels more like filler CD for singletarget fights.

It's not just the fact that block is stronger than parry. It's also the fact that PLD is the only tank which has access to both. Even passively, PLD has an advantage over other tanks when it comes to physical mitigation, before you take into account factors like the unique str down debuff and Sheltron. Bulwark definitely has its uses against bosses - not all high damage moments in fights occur in the form of a singular tankbuster. Bulwark is great for softening up the rate of incoming damage, and by extension, facilitating stance dancing.

DD is an amazing skill, but I'd happily trade in the DA evasion element for a short duration physical damage reduction ability. That's the one thing that's really missing from our kit. The evasion is fun and gives a unique style to the class, but it also feels unreliable and doesn't have the best synergy with the parry part of the skill.