How to Dragoon per Second: A DPS Paradigm

[Ninjah2r]

drg app? fuck yeah count me in, I want that

[TheKingSlayer]

FYI Whiskey, Excel has a "Help" section that will take to free online courses that teaches you all the basics and even some of the more advanced techniques. Its free and they are extremely useful.

https://support.office.com/en-us/art...rs=en-US&ad=US

The 2007 Training courses are very good.

[JackFross]

So for anyone who wants to mess around with it, you can check it out here!

It's a .xlsm - macro-enabled excel file. You need to enable macros if you want it to work as best as it can. I'll ofc be updating it for 3.2 and uploading a better version then. This is more like a beta lol

As far as a visual way of arranging buffs, Excel has an incredible amount of columns and rows. You can narrow them up and treat each column as 1 second, if you wanted to, or even treat each one as 0.5 seconds. You'd be filling in blocks of them, and merge+center does wonders even when you have a shitton of columns being used.

[Ninjah2r]

Sup with multidotting in dungeons during pulls? how much difference does that give us in dps if we apply dots on every mob the tank pulled, instead of aoe'ing with RoT/DS/GK?

[whiskeybravo]

As far as a visual way of arranging buffs, Excel has an incredible amount of columns and rows. You can narrow them up and treat each column as 1 second, if you wanted to, or even treat each one as 0.5 seconds. You'd be filling in blocks of them, and merge+center does wonders even when you have a shitton of columns being used.

I did start out that way but the problem I found is you can't drag them around easily to try different arrangements. I was looking to make something more akin to a puzzle that you can piece together. Maybe there is a way but my Excel class level isn't high enough to figure it out xD

(thanks for that suggestion btw, King)

Sup with multidotting in dungeons during pulls? how much difference does that give us in dps if we apply dots on every mob the tank pulled, instead of aoe'ing with RoT/DS/GK?

The chart a few pages back breaks it down pretty well. I experimented in dungeons with a few dif things, mainly running out of TP lol. But I think in big pulls you should always start with buffed DS spam, 9 shots before you reapply HT. Will leave you with around 400+ TP. After that you can switch to a single-target rotation or HT-RoT or a few more DS depending on your feels. HT-RoT is a bit more conservative on TP than Doomspike if you need to keep aoe'ing, just make sure you get the positional buff. If it's 3 or 4 enemies just put up CT on each and GK away (unless they are about to die, then TTT4 instead). Also just wanted to add, you can't put dot's up on everything. Well, you could put them up I suppose, but after the 3rd enemy it will fall off the first so really you can only keep them up on 3 enemies.

[Sekundessounet]

Hello there !

So, I'm currently on A3S with my static, but we're struggling to end the Phase 2 because we don't meet the DPS check on Hand of Pain. Personnaly, I'm trying to have every CD up for this mechanic so I stop using them after the first Wash Away, so I can have my full opener during the mechanic (this include not using a Drac Pot and Battle Litany at the begining).
Is that okay ? Or should I do otherwise ? Everyone in the static is with the Thordan Ex weapon (DRK/WAR/WHM/SCH/DRG/NIN/BRD/SMN), and the WHM is having the DMG down debuff (while I have the vulnerability up).
We loose at like 4.2% of the gap between the two hands.

And should I stop using Dragonfire Dive and Geirskogul if the hands are packed ?

[Sigmakan]

The hands should always be "packed" (im assuming you mean together) during the hand of pain portion. That way the other tank can help dps the other hand.

I would keep using Dragonfire and Geirskogul, because its essentially the same thing as not using them. might as well get some additional over all dps in.

[whiskeybravo]

A wise DRG once told me that nobody should be holding back CDs during the fight specifically for equal concentration. I recently started raiding with a new group and it's certainly a spot where people get hung up. Taking that advice, I don't hold anything back, and I told them that as well. I GK and DFD and while I don't reapply the dots after HP exchange I do try to keep at least disembowel and ct up on both hands before that. What I've been doing after the split/2nd wash away I tag whichever is closer with HT-IDC then elusive jump back towards the middle and 4th IDC the second one, then play it by ear until the swap.. I don't know if that's ideal or not but keeps my dps above 1300 if I don't mess anything up along the way.

[JackFross]

So, I'm currently on A3S with my static, but we're struggling to end the Phase 2 because we don't meet the DPS check on Hand of Pain.

If everyone is rocking mostly 210 gear with 205 weapons AND you're stacking all your buffs for a full opener on the HoP hand, I have no idea how else to say this:

Your group is honestly just not very good.

The only reason you should be failing the Hand of Pain dps check at this point is suboptimal play or having two dps get stuck with Damage Down in that phase. My group has cleared the check easily with the first Damage Down not getting passed. We've cleared it with someone (me ;-; ) dying in phase 1 and having Weakness through the check. Someone isn't optimizing things.

Outside of that, it could be party comp. If you have SMN, SCH, BRD all multi-dotting the hands, you're losing a LOT there, requiring the melee (and MNK should be using Rockbreaker, so he isn't doing max ST either) to do a hell of a lot of extra damage to kill the check in time. Someone might also be attacking the wrong one. Are BOTH tanks hitting the right one? Is either tank in tank stance there? (Neither one should be; you should have plenty of CDs you can burn that you don't need for Drainage)


Basically, ranged DPS who get gains from multi-dotting/aoe should be multi-dotting/doing aoe. Tanks should drop tank stance and both attack the HoP target. SCH should be 100% dps uptime there and multi-dotting with all Broils focused on the main hand. If you're close to failing, it's worth it to have BRD/MCH not multi-dot and SMN stop using Painflare and use Fester instead, but there's no reason at all that people should just outright stop ALL AoE to clear it.


tl;dr: It's not your fault. You shouldn't have to hold CDs for it. Parse. Tell your group to get good. Figure out if someone is hitting the wrong hand. ONE COMBO on the wrong hand can cause a wipe, especially with AoE going on. I know that from experience. </3


The second Wash for me is usually ID>Dis>CT>4th>Phleb>ID on main hand through wash (following him the whole way, usually with Elusive Jump used) and then tab-target to the other to drop Dis>CT>[life surge]>4th and there's IR somewhere idk, but after that is HT>TTT4 on whichever hand, followed by ID> [hop target] >Dis>CT. And keep the gsks flowing. You shouldn't be holding buffs for the HoP. If you have a NIN, TA is pretty baller for killing the check. If not, you're gonna need SOMEBODY to take a hit and stop multi-dotting, more than likely, if you wanna clear it consistently.

[Sekundessounet]

Well last I checked everyone was bursting the right hand and the SMN stopped multi-DoTing a while ago. Maybe it comes from the Scholar trying to keep both tanks alive ?

Otherwise thanks for the advices everyone :3