Whats with people hating F2P?

[kuma_aus]

-snip-

Yeah XIV already does that stuff in regards to cosmetics. But to a very minor scale compared to how it will be as F2P. We have 1 mount in the Mog Shop. If this was F2P, can you imagine how many would be in there? Don't worry about getting mounts from Beast Tribe quests. Don't worry about getting mounts from playing tanks in high level content. Don't worry about getting mounts from Extreme primals. All would be cash shop and tradeable.

Do you enjoy leveling up alt jobs and classes? Rule #1 of F2P games, make leveling a pain in the bum. Then introduce EXP charms. Everything to make leveling easier like leves as well will need to be nerfed, so people have reason to buy these tradeable EXP charms. Works even better for FFXIV because of all those alt jobs you got to work on.

Also how much do you like seasonal events? Well that's great, you can do the quests like normal, but the glamour? Cash shop of course, got to have holiday themed items in there for limited time so people know that they need to buy it quickly. You will still get a glamour from in game normally. Say the leggings from the event, that's a nice free costume to give away but the rest is needed to be sold so the game can run.

Like look how many people are subscribed to the game. Now you remove the subscription, how is FFXIV meant to make up all that money from the cash shop only if they don't make the game experience living hell for us?

[Catwho]

Like look how many people are subscribed to the game. Now you remove the subscription, how is FFXIV meant to make up all that money from the cash shop only if they don't make the game experience living hell for us?

Lowball estimate is that SE is raking in 8-10 million dollars a month from subscriptions alone (based on the most recent estimates of 800K active paying characters, which probably spiked a lot in the last few weeks when people came back.)

To cough up 10 million gil in cash shop revenue, then everything not nailed down in the game would be for sale on the cash shop instead.

[Atoli]

To cough up 10 million gil in cash shop revenue, then everything not nailed down in the game would be for sale on the cash shop instead.

^If SE is fine with Gil instead of Dollars, F2P might not be too bad..

[Saccharin]

I see no basis for this claim whatsoever. Nothing in the cash shop goes beyond cosmetic items.

Based on what exactly? In the past six months, the only content added to their Cash Shop has been old Scion cosplay, dyes also accessible in the game, bits and pieces of summer seasonal wear and Halloween outfits. None of this indicates a game gearing towards a heavy Cash Shop model. In fact, it suggests the opposite.

they put the most coveted things on the cash shops. First we had the odin mount, then we had the Scion outfits. How many threads have we had that asked for Minfillia outfits and hair. Countless. They even put unique dyes on the shop. these days it's what will people pay for now.

These might be cosmetic but as we've seen with glamours cosmetic is content these days and the best is now for sale - only for sale.

Everybody in this thread keeps hating on F2P. Calling it Free to Lose, Pay to Win, whatever.

Yep! And that explains why to this day, FF14 and WoW are the two biggest video games played on computer. Certainly, there's no possible way that a free to play game could ever succeed, or be balanced in a way that you can achieve play at the absolute highest level without ever spending a dime on the game. SURELY there's no possible way that they could succeed if they just pushed you to spend real money on things to speed up grinding a bit, or by giving you amazing cosmetic changes to your character that you'd actually WANT to spend money on. No game has ever been able to do that before.

Sorry friend, but LoL is small game (any MOBA is) compared to a MMORPG.
You just can't go and compare 2 completely different genres.

League of Legends, while not my type of game is hugely successful and even more profitable than WoW (now).

It's also a MOBA not an MMORPG.

[karateorangutang]

League of Legends, while not my type of game is hugely successful and even more profitable than WoW (now).

It's also a MOBA not an MMORPG.

Agreed, but i think he meant small in the terms of sheer volume of code. LoL has lots of characters, but very little in the terms of maps size and design, quests, and pve programming. It's small by comparison that way.

[StrejdaTom]

Agreed, but i think he meant small in the terms of sheer volume of code. LoL has lots of characters, but very little in the terms of maps size and design, quests, and pve programming. It's small by comparison that way.

That's exactly what I meant (also my second post in this thread says so).
MOBA game has one or a few maps, one hero per month and that's it. In my opinion MMORPG requires much more money, staff and also financial risk (developement costs).

I think it is impossible to introduce F2P MMO that wouldn't end up P2W and would still have enough money to introduce new content in the way FFXIV does it.
Most F2P MMOs just introduce new stuff to cash shop and one huge patch once a year. That's not my idea of fun.

[CGMidlander]

That's exactly what I meant (also my second post in this thread says so).
MOBA game has one or a few maps, one hero per month and that's it. In my opinion MMORPG requires much more money, staff and also financial risk (developement costs).

I think it is impossible to introduce F2P MMO that wouldn't end up P2W and would still have enough money to introduce new content in the way FFXIV does it.
Most F2P MMOs just introduce new stuff to cash shop and one huge patch once a year. That's not my idea of fun.

It's not just your opinion; it's fact.
The development costs for MOBAs is more or less limited to just balancing and adding characters, and making skins.
They're very limited in scope compared to an MMORPG. (e.g. Crafting/gathering systems, PvE/PvP combat systems, Minigames, Quest lines, Story, Instances, World design...etc.)

[Ashkendor]

they put the most coveted things on the cash shops. First we had the odin mount, then we had the Scion outfits. How many threads have we had that asked for Minfillia outfits and hair. Countless. They even put unique dyes on the shop. these days it's what will people pay for now.

Your original post said we were going toward a "cash shop heavy model," which implies that it's moving beyond cosmetic items into other categories. An example of a cash shop heavy model would be a game that offers exp boost scrolls, extra character slots, costumes with stats, enhancement protection items, and access to premium areas along with the cosmetic items like mounts and dyes. Everything we have in the cash shop is staying in one category - cosmetic. The dyes aren't even remotely unique anymore so that's a completely moot point. I've gotten more metallic dye than I know what to do with from retainer ventures.

These might be cosmetic but as we've seen with glamours cosmetic is content these days and the best is now for sale - only for sale.

I agree with you that cosmetic items are content, but this is an entirely subjective statement. We have a lot of good looking glamours in game. I wouldn't take a Thancred cosplay over a Thavnarian Bolero set or a High House set, for example. Some people may have wanted Minfilia's set but I personally don't care for it, and wouldn't have purchased it even when I had a female avatar.

I think Sleipnir is one fugly horse and refuse to purchase him. I would rather ride... well, basically anything else. I'm sure there's people that don't particularly like the new Magitek recolors, either. I personally have 35 mounts to choose from right now, none of which were purchased from the cash shop. I still have to do a couple more days of Vanu dailies to earn the Sanuwa, 100+ duties to earn the Panther, and earn another 300+ commendations to get the Fat Chocobo reskin. There's way more items available ingame than there are in the cash shop, which doesn't really support your argument that we're moving toward a cash shop heavy model.

[seraf]

I don't hate F2P in concept but every single F2P MMORPG that I've played has been very reliant on Pay2Win cash shop stuff to entice players to buy from it.