NIN -- how does everyone else feel we're doing?

[Aiselia]

other classes are using there full dps combos

A monk will never be using their full DPS combos unless they're with another monk in the party for some reason (who then has to be the one applying DK, for a DPS loss on them).

Dragon Kick is the worse DPS option over Bootshine because Bootshine is 150 potency with guaranteed crit positional while DK is 100 potency with 150 potency positional and chance to crit.

At least you have another class that can apply your debuff.

The more people complain about having to apply their own debuff without a warrior or about how tough it is to have to hit two predictable positionals every what, 20 seconds, the less it looks like they really need to be buffed to compare to other melee, because they just look spoiled.

You are the only melee that has another class that can apply your debuff for you. You are the only melee with rare AND predictable positionals. Not only predictable, but controllable, too. You're on Gust Slash and about to do AE but the boss puts AOE down on his butt? You get to move to the side and hit AC and at least hit your positional. Monks don't. Dragoons don't.

[Pluvia]

A monk will never be using their full DPS combos unless they're with another monk in the party for some reason (who then has to be the one applying DK, for a DPS loss on them).

Dragon Kick is the worse DPS option over Bootshine because Bootshine is 150 potency with guaranteed crit positional while DK is 100 potency with 150 potency positional and chance to crit.

At least you have another class that can apply your debuff.

The more people complain about having to apply their own debuff without a warrior or about how tough it is to have to hit two predictable positionals every what, 20 seconds, the less it looks like they really need to be buffed to compare to other melee, because they just look spoiled.

You are the only melee that has another class that can apply your debuff for you. You are the only melee with rare AND predictable positionals. Not only predictable, but controllable, too. You're on Gust Slash and about to do AE but the boss puts AOE down on his butt? You get to move to the side and hit AC and at least hit your positional. Monks don't. Dragoons don't.

Yet we have the most punishing positional of them all Trick Attack which isn't only a screw up for your own rotation but a complete screw up for the whole raid and needs to be changed.

Just to give prospective on the whole matter only major thing i can see needing changed right now is Trick attack and TP issues for the 100th time i've had to reply to things in these threads
But Atreides does have a point Monk is a lot more fluid in its normal rotation then ninja. Ninjutsu is like hitting a road stop to weigh in as a truck at least every 60s if you don't have bad spikes before you can continue on.

[Aiselia]

Yet we have the most punishing positional of them all Trick Attack

Every 60 seconds. And you can delay it for up to 10 seconds after Suiton if sudden AOE happens.

[Pluvia]

Guess you've never heard of the phrase shit happens I've had tanks who've had to dodge at the most inopportune times so why should ninja be punished when no other melee is punished for missing positionals anymore except for a loss of potency. So can we have some kind of fail mechanic for Battle Litany?

[ChaozK]

Guess you've never heard of the phrase shit happens. So can we have some kind of fail mechanic for Battle Litany?

Funnily enough, i am hearing a lot of frustration from BLMs/SMNs when they happen to step out of BL's max range and miss the buff. I always chuckle a bit inside, lolmage

[Aiselia]

So can we have some kind of fail mechanic for Battle Litany?

When Ninjutsu locks you in position for as long as Jump, sure.

Actually, that's a great solution to Ninjutsus. Make them all have cast times.

Then you get to feel what it's like to have to time it like Jump AND it fixes mudra lag!

[Subucnimorning]

When Ninjutsu locks you in position for as long as Jump, sure.

Actually, that's a great solution to Ninjutsus. Make them all have cast times.

Then you get to feel what it's like to have to time it like Jump AND it fixes mudra lag!

Assassinate locks you for longer than Jumps now, just saying.

[Allyrion]

Yet we have the most punishing positional of them all Trick Attack which isn't only a screw up for your own rotation but a complete screw up for the whole raid needs to be changed.

The personal potency lost is understandable.
The Vulnerability Up shouldn't be tied to the positional though.
I've forgiven it up to now because it's only once a minute, but in the end you're right.

Effect being tied to positionals is the old drg design, which wasn't good.
You shouldn't lose that raid CD for a missed positional.

That and TP are probably what NIN needs most.
Well not counting Mudra lag, which everyone agrees is an issue. Just not sure if that'll be fixed soon.

[Subucnimorning]

The personal potency lost is understandable.
The Vulnerability Up shouldn't be tied to the positional though.
I've forgiven it up to now because it's only once a minute, but in the end you're right.

Effect being tied to positionals is the old drg design, which was good.
You shouldn't lose that raid CD for a missed positional.

That and TP are probably what NIN needs most.
Well not counting Mudra lag, which everyone agrees is an issue. Just not sure if that'll be fixed soon.

Couldn't agree more, people can compare 9/12 abilities for NIN don't require positionals to MNK all but ToD requiring positionals, but DRG or MNK don't have abilities that just don't work if you miss the positional that affects the entire raid's dps.

[Atreides]

Dragon Kick VS. Dancing Edge

Really? You can hardly compare a skill that you use of the START of a combo with a skill you have to dedicate a whole combo.
I main Monk and this statement is really not working, if Dragon Kick happens to Crit you lose nothing both skills have a 150 potency, it's just like Bootshine but Dancing Edge on the other hand is a DPS loss compared to Aeolians Edge no matter what.

I don't even care about positionals because positionals are piss easy.
Doesn't change the fact that Ninjas do have the one positional that gets punished the most if missed.

The funny part is positionals are the only thing going for monk which appearently makes us hard to play and people are adamant in defendig it.
If you can't hit a positional go out of you way and use Fracture or Touch of Death while moving to where you need to be.
Other jobs don't have that option because Monk work with "stances", they just suck up a straight DPS loss.