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  1. #111
    Player
    Kaedan94's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    481
    Character
    Kinako Kuromitsu
    World
    Tonberry
    Main Class
    Fisher Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Mikhaill View Post


    Yeeep, that's exactly what happened. You ask for DMG? Sure! We'll remove your mobility, nyaha!
    Something had to go, and it wasn't going to be their supportive skills since it already hinders you anyways.
    Casting though seems lame. I'd feel more upset that I'd be playing another BLM named BOM [Bowmage.]
    I like the fast shooting of a BRD. Dunno how it is past 52.
    It's not casting. It's taking aim/charge time. All the BRD weaponskills didn't suddenly become spells. They just take slightly longer to fire because you're taking careful aim.

    Sadly I think much of the problem could be fixed if they simply renamed the "waiting bar" for BRDs to be "Aim bar" or "Charge bar".

    As I said before, for those who weren't needlessly hyperactive bunnies in 2.x, nothing changed with the introduction of WM.
    (3)

  2. #112
    Player
    Gilraen's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    2,489
    Character
    Gilraen Bior
    World
    Midgardsormr
    Main Class
    Archer Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Duelle View Post
    Likewise, you can't just throw in a stance at lv52 and call it done.
    And they didn't. They gave us three new attacks that only work while in said stance. But, as a reminder of what you really should be concerned about, they also gave us a new support song.
    (2)

  3. #113
    Player
    Mikhaill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    616
    Character
    Xetsu Mitsuhara
    World
    Goblin
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaedan94 View Post
    It's not casting. It's taking aim/charge time. All the BRD weaponskills didn't suddenly become spells. They just take slightly longer to fire because you're taking careful aim.

    Sadly I think much of the problem could be fixed if they simply renamed the "waiting bar" for BRDs to be "Aim bar" or "Charge bar".

    As I said before, for those who weren't needlessly hyperactive bunnies in 2.x, nothing changed with the introduction of WM.
    Not sure, but are you using semantics? Casting/Aiming/Charging/Conjuring whatever.
    They're the same thing. Shoulda left BRD as it was and added more support skills, and if they want this Aim/Charge thing, they should of slapped on Machinist and called it new.
    Not put it on both physical range DPS. That's stupid. I'm personally upset we get a rare to use support skill.
    (3)

  4. #114
    Player

    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    1,132
    Quote Originally Posted by Duelle View Post
    Likewise, you can't just throw in a stance at lv52 and call it done.
    You mean like they did with WAR at 30 with Defiance and at 52 with Deliverance? We only get special abilities for each stance later too.

    Wanderer's Minuet only has a problem if Bard DPS isn't noticeably increased. If it is, then your mobility is the price to pay for increased DPS.

    We all know that what Bards really wanted was to have equivalent DPS as the other classes while keeping their mobility (and higher survivability) intact. Anyone that cares about class balance knew that could never happen.
    (1)

  5. #115
    Player
    Duelle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    3,965
    Character
    Duelle Urelle
    World
    Diabolos
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilraen View Post
    And they didn't. They gave us three new attacks that only work while in said stance. But, as a reminder of what you really should be concerned about, they also gave us a new support song.
    You're missing the point.

    Goal: Do something to BRD to give it more DPS.

    Option A: Add a secondary system that is cohesive with the job's gameplay
    Option B: Change BRD gameplay at the base, reducing mobility by giving cast times to some abilities, retune or redesign the procs to work with the new gameplay
    Option C: Throw in a stance late in the job's lifespan that gives almost everything a cast time and gate two new skills behind it to force BRDs to use it

    The developers chose C.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilthas View Post
    You mean like they did with WAR at 30 with Defiance and at 52 with Deliverance? We only get special abilities for each stance later too.
    Deliverance builds on something WARs were already doing anyways (DPSing when not main tanking).

    Now, if you want to Deliverance to switch places with Unchained or Steel Cyclone for the sake of getting it earlier in the leveling processing, that's fine too, I guess.
    (4)
    Last edited by Duelle; 08-04-2015 at 11:04 AM.
    * The sad thing is that FFXIV turned RDM into a turret, and people think that's what it's supposed to be. It's supposed to combine sword and magic into something more, not spend the bulk of gameplay spamming spells and jump into melee for only 3 GCDs before scurrying back to the back line like good little casters.
    * Design ideas:
    Red Mage - COMPLETE (https://tinyurl.com/y6tsbnjh), Chemist - Second Pass (https://tinyurl.com/ssuog88), Thief - First Pass (https://tinyurl.com/vdjpkoa), Rune Fencer - First Pass (https://tinyurl.com/y3fomdp2)

  6. #116
    Player
    Kaedan94's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    481
    Character
    Kinako Kuromitsu
    World
    Tonberry
    Main Class
    Fisher Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Mikhaill View Post
    Not sure, but are you using semantics? Casting/Aiming/Charging/Conjuring whatever.
    They're the same thing. Shoulda left BRD as it was and added more support skills, and if they want this Aim/Charge thing, they should of slapped on Machinist and called it new.
    Not put it on both physical range DPS. That's stupid. I'm personally upset we get a rare to use support skill.
    BRDs complained that they don't do as much damage as melee or BLMs. So SE listened and added a way for them to boost their damage. But they couldn't just boost their damage and not require a trade off. That would make them incredibly OP. So the trade off is precisely the reason they did lower damage to begin with... mobility.

    But SE, being fairly generous, only made the "Aim time" 1.5s, which is still enough time to escape any AoE due to being able to move after hitting 75% charge. So BRD gameplay essentially didn't change at all.

    The only people who are complaining are those who ran around during combat for no reason whatsoever. Anyone who did any serious content actually realizes that it's detrimental to do that, as you could adversely affect someone else in the party. Which is why BRDs who do content like Coil or Alex Savage don't complain... they don't have a reason to. For us, nothing about BRD changed except we get 30% more damage and extra oGCD skills. Awesome!
    (6)

  7. #117
    Player
    Khyan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Raids
    Posts
    218
    Character
    Khyan Leikas
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Arcanist Lv 60
    What I see on this post : "I'm bard, I want easy dps, no cast times and still good amount of dps. These cast times are so boriiiiiiing I have a bad amount of dps even with the up from 15 to 30% on minuet, I hit less than a blackmage it's not fairrrrrrrr, I don't want to dodge anything like other casters." Lel.

    A bard is supposed to be a dps with a support role, usefull on raids. As if he was going to do as much damage as a monk, seriously? If you compare a bard with a blackmage this job wasn't for you anyway. Glad you leave it.
    (3)

  8. #118
    Player
    RiceisNice's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    3,514
    Character
    Flo Fyloord
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilthas View Post
    You mean like they did with WAR at 30 with Defiance and at 52 with Deliverance? We only get special abilities for each stance later too.

    Wanderer's Minuet only has a problem if Bard DPS isn't noticeably increased. If it is, then your mobility is the price to pay for increased DPS.

    We all know that what Bards really wanted was to have equivalent DPS as the other classes while keeping their mobility (and higher survivability) intact. Anyone that cares about class balance knew that could never happen.
    Just to throw this out. Bard isn't doing more dps relatively as they were in 2.0 with WM. you also can't really compare defiance/deliverance since they do not fundamentally change how a warrior plays. Defiance improves upon what their primary role is (tanking and emnity generation) while deliverance improves on their damage when not otherwise tanking, all working off their inherent toolkit; Imagine if Deliverance was slapped on but had absolutely no interaction with your 2.0 skills (meaning no stacks from weaponskills), and the only way could get abandon was getting infuriate and then changing to deliverance. WM does not interact well with bard's 2.0 toolkit, specifically the detection delay on their procs (which was done without cast times in mind) and oGCD resets, leading to doubling GCDs with an effective 1 second downtime per weaponskill or delaying weapon skills.

    And it's far from mobility being the offender to why some of us hate WM, but the people who knock it either don't seem to get the reasoning or even play bard long enough to acknowledge it.
    (8)
    Last edited by RiceisNice; 08-04-2015 at 12:12 PM.
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  9. #119
    Player Kiyyto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Ul-Dah
    Posts
    118
    Character
    Quint Thriceheart
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by MilesSaintboroguh View Post
    Sorry, this kind of thread was the "in" thing to do weeks ago. Now it's trendy to complain about red scrips and crafting. Get with the times!
    But it'll never be as trendy as complaining about complaining, that remains king of the ffxiv forum lurker's fav things to do.
    (2)

  10. #120
    Player Kiyyto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Location
    Ul-Dah
    Posts
    118
    Character
    Quint Thriceheart
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 60
    I don't give a darn about dps, and I'll still play bard when I want but I'll keep WM off.
    As I said, the only people sqex really hurt with this is anyone who has to play with a brd
    (1)

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