Goodbye Battle Regimens

[Arcell]

You are not doing it right. BR deals massive damage when done right, it's all about communication.

I will definitely miss BR and gonna hate spamming AoE WS for the next 2 patches or more. /sigh

Exactly, 10000% this. Most of the people who complain about battle regimens never took the time to learn the system. My LS regularly utilizes them in all boss/NM fights and it makes things go by much quicker. I can deal without them for a bit but hopefully they'll come back better than ever.

[Zanfire]

Exactly, 10000% this. Most of the people who complain about battle regimens never took the time to learn the system. My LS regularly utilizes them in all boss/NM fights and it makes things go by much quicker. I can deal without them for a bit but hopefully they'll come back better than ever.

oh i know how to do them, and they are useful, its just that they feel like its extra clicks for the sake of extra clicks. Its more about it not being a quick and simple process over "its not useful". The reason why people love SCs is because of how easy it is to use, not activating it, then select a skill, then click to use it. SC is simple WS, other guy WSs within a few second and thats it.

not sure why so many people would be against making BRs simple to use with less clicking (and how aweful it was when BR used to lock you half the time) Theres a reason they are changing it...

[Perrin_Aybarra]

oh i know how to do them, and they are useful, its just that they feel like its extra clicks for the sake of extra clicks. Its more about it not being a quick and simple process over "its not useful". The reason why people love SCs is because of how easy it is to use, not activating it, then select a skill, then click to use it. SC is simple WS, other guy WSs within a few second and thats it.

not sure why so many people would be against making BRs simple to use with less clicking (and how aweful it was when BR used to lock you half the time) Theres a reason they are changing it...

People like to defend unoptimized system just for the sake of arguing and calling people down by telling them they don't know how to use the BR.

Fact is, no one in their right mind could favor the BR "input action to queue and wait" system over the more intuitive system the SC had. It's not a matter of damage and how the mobs die quickly anyways. They can keep the idea of the BR and debuff system, just the way to USE it should be modified to be like SC were used

Want to do an attack debuff? Instead of iniating a BR with a normal attack and wait for someone to queue another normal attack and then wait for the BR to be initiated, why would people be so against just calling out you are about to do a normal attack and then someone else could do another normal attack to successfully perform the regimen.

The only adjustment would need to determine which normal attacks could be used for it and give them a proper CD (20-30sec) so that you cannot spam the regimen and forces you to coordinate the attacks.

Edit: just to be clear, I am not arguing the effectiveness of well executed BR nor the fact that SCs ala FFXI would be useless against grinding mobs (so are BR mostly). I am arguing that the current BR system is unoptimized and very cumbersome to use, not at all intuitive.

[Alcide]

People like to defend unoptimized system just for the sake of arguing and calling people down by telling them they don't know how to use the BR.

Fact is, no one in their right mind could favor the BR "input action to queue and wait" system over the more intuitive system the SC had. It's not a matter of damage and how the mobs die quickly anyways. They can keep the idea of the BR and debuff system, just the way to USE it should be modified to be like SC were used

Want to do an attack debuff? Instead of iniating a BR with a normal attack and wait for someone to queue another normal attack and then wait for the BR to be initiated, why would people be so against just calling out you are about to do a normal attack and then someone else could do another normal attack to successfully perform the regimen.

The only adjustment would need to determine which normal attacks could be used for it and give them a proper CD (20-30sec) so that you cannot spam the regimen and forces you to coordinate the attacks.

Edit: just to be clear, I am not arguing the effectiveness of well executed BR nor the fact that SCs ala FFXI would be useless against grinding mobs (so are BR mostly). I am arguing that the current BR system is unoptimized and very cumbersome to use, not at all intuitive.

I might say that people like to defend an old and disorganized system like SC just for the sake of saying "XI was better".

Face it, BR is the natural evolution of SC, the reason why you have to stack a skill is that whenever you do so you're SURE a BR is gonna be performed, wheter it's gonna be effective or not depends on the player's knowledge of the system. You just can't say the same about SC, you could do tons of attempts, doing 10 WS asking for a SC and you could potentially never see one (honestly I find it hard to belive that anyone who played XI never had issues getting ppl to perform SC in random parties).

And we say that people don't like BR because they don't know how to use it because the only argument is the waiting time. You just don't have to wait, if you're waiting your party is doing it wrong. Organize yourself and communicate with your party (damn it's an mmo, you HAVE to communicate -.-) untill you get a nice timing.

@Zanfire: SHIFT+skill if using the keyboard, emote instead of select on the skill if using the gamepad, only one person press an extra button to release, I really don't think the execution can be made simplier...

[Arcell]

And we say that people don't like BR because they don't know how to use it because the only argument is the waiting time. You just don't have to wait, if you're waiting your party is doing it wrong. Organize yourself and communicate with your party (damn it's an mmo, you HAVE to communicate -.-) untill you get a nice timing.

@Zanfire: SHIFT+skill if using the keyboard, emote instead of select on the skill if using the gamepad, only one person press an extra button to release, I really don't think the execution can be made simplier...

Exactly. Honestly if the party I'm with is lagging on timing with BRs I just tend to start giving them timed ultimatums. Starting BR, 10 seconds and I'm activating it. This tends to get people to respond much more quickly Otherwise though if you communicate with your group it's very easy to get these done in less than 5 seconds.

Also now with auto-attack being "stuck" in BR mode isn't even as big of a problem. You can still use your auto-attack and move in BR mode.

[Perrin_Aybarra]

Exactly. Honestly if the party I'm with is lagging on timing with BRs I just tend to start giving them timed ultimatums. Starting BR, 10 seconds and I'm activating it. This tends to get people to respond much more quickly Otherwise though if you communicate with your group it's very easy to get these done in less than 5 seconds.

Also now with auto-attack being "stuck" in BR mode isn't even as big of a problem. You can still use your auto-attack and move in BR mode.

Maybe for a melee this isn't an issue, I'll give you that. An archer or a mage on the other hand just waits there like a fool until it's executed. Even if it's a 5-10sec wait, it's still 5-10 too long of doing nothing while maybe the tank needs a cure.

@Alcide, if you read what I said, I do not defend FFXI's SC nor do I attack the idea of the BR system. I like the fact that it's very flexible and the various effect it has. What is clunky and very unituitive is the way we have to execute it. It's not a matter of communication nor of understanding the system. It's a matter of execution.

Like I said, a 5-10 wait is still too long. I like how SC were executed and I don't see how it could not be applied to the BR concept when it comes to initiating and closing a BR.

Edit: Like you said though in the post above, BR is not perfect and could be improved which is exactly what they are doing. What's the point in arguing and defending it when it does need improvements.

[Alcide]

Edit: Like you said though in the post above, BR is not perfect and could be improved which is exactly what they are doing. What's the point in arguing and defending it when it does need improvements.

But don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's a perfect system, I think it's really poor in combinations and gets boring after the "WHOOOOA DAMAGE!" thing, but still the foundation is easy to teach, easy to understand and easy to perform.
I think that with the correct tweaking it has the potential to be a much more interesting and intuitive system than SC. I know they're changing it and that's a good thing, but I hope they're gonna fix and improve it rather than scrap it and go back to SC.

I think this has to be sayed since everytime they try to fix something they just scrap it >.>