Repetitive grind parties should NOT be the main source of leveling

[indira]

should be a OPTION

[zaviermhigo]

How are we supposed to level without repeatedly killing mobs in some form?
-do quest kill x mobs at y location
-guildleves kill mobs while running around like a retard
-grinding kill mobs in set location (in future when chains are added, i bet these complainers would quit complaining when they're faces melt off with high chain sp, but then again they prob won't make it into that party cause they're so against grinding mobs over and over again)

Seriously every mmo in the world has some mechanic that is boring and repetitive, if you don't like it make your own mmo.

[Kiara]

Hi Ventus and All,

It's a very good question & topic. I guess the big picture question is:

* What *do* you do in an MMO (specifically RPG) that would be a better way to increase / improve / get better / grow?

Even offline RPGs, the "classic grind" of killing monsters throughout the world to level up and get better has been around since the earliest of days.

I think with unlimited budget and unlimited manpower, a "dream scenario" for leveling up / progressing / getting better in an MMORPG for me would be:

• Going on interesting, engaging, challenging *Adventures* with Story & Lore, with friends / strangers in a party, and growing stronger from it.
  
  Specifically, imagine the level of quality from "Chains of Promathea" Story Missions: The amazing cinematography, interesting storyline, production values, and unlocking new lands, etc.
  
  Imagine if doing each Mission (with a challenging difficulty) rewarded Players with lots of XP / SP and you could gain Levels that way.

THAT would be my ideal way to "level" in an MMORPG.

But I think we all agree, the production costs would be astronomical. I don't think they can provide that level of quality, writing, storytelling, missions, new areas, challenging content *fast enough* and with enough of them, to satisfy the Hardcore MMO players (who'd get through content too fast), Average gamers or Casual gamers (only can put in a few hours per week).

So what else can an MMORPG do to "fill the void"? It's a tough question. Some people loved Conquest, Ein, Dynamis, Sky, BCNMs, etc., in FF XI. And that's a game that had years under its belt before it had a breadth of content for it later.

Is it through Questing (with good production values, cinematics, etc.)? Probably not feasible.

Could it be through an *interesting* Combat System (via Parties)? Possibly.

If this new Final Fantasy Job System with revamped Skillchains (or some Dynamic Combat Layer (like developing something from Chrono Trigger, etc.)) could be added, with ways to develop interesting methods to kill monsters, that in-and-of-itself could be a great, fun way to spend hours battling through various mobs around Eorzea (with friends). That would make "grinding" less tedious for sure.

But after a while even that would get repetitive.

I think the answer lies with balance of a variety of things to do.

If they add in a Chocobo Raising System (like Final Fantasy VII (Gold Saucer Chocobo Races! ), added in other interesting things to do, that's something else that keeps people interested.

I'd like there to be something else besides the Grind. I'd say 1.18 is a start in the right direction (with Dungeons that you can SP in, with some production values, Class System changes, and Grand Companies). I'm curious to see what else comes from 1.19 and 1.20.

[Sortis]

Seeing by your signature, seems like your highest rank is 16. Before when a LOT of people were actually playing this game, not many people worried about leves because grinding crabs and adventuring was the right way to rank up. We traveled far from the aetheryte sometimes and everything was fine. It was the leves that restricted people to aetherytes after the sp changes. Now that sp and battle is different, people are slowly venturing out since leves isn't the most viable way to get sp, and honestly, I don't think it should be.

Recently came back to the game and deleted my old character(wanted a fresh start) but yeah I get what you're saying.

[kukurumei]

Seriously every mmo in the world has some mechanic that is boring and repetitive, if you don't like it make your own mmo.

Actually there are private servers for people that complain in that way...very small, and highly pvp ghost towns.

their method of leveling /addexp 9999999

You're either running the same repeatable quest, the same repeatable dungeon, or the same repeatable monster...not much difference. Maybe if you paid a little more, you can have some text to go with that repetition.

[RemnantWolf]

Well that is true. I didn't think that me posting the explanation would make it happen. I just wanted to have a bit of hope, a little fun brainstorming how it would work, and I knew that I wouldn't lose anything for doing so. That plus there may be a chance (though as likely to happen as finding one specific grain of sand in the desert -scale of exaggeration may vary-) that they may decide to do it and seeing how I said to to it may save them a meeting or two (sometimes deciding on the mechanics of something like this is half the battle).

[Ventus]

I have a feeling that people will complain no matter how many different ways they give us to get exp.

I mean really, Repetitive grind parties should NOT be the main source of leveling? But repetitive leves should? At least we have more ways then one to level up... which, are basically the same thing just in different forms.

You obviously haven't read enough posts I've made in this thread because you just assumed a plethora of things right there. Please think before posting. No where did I endorse or support repeating leves mindlessly as a better alternative.

[Ventus]

How are we supposed to level without repeatedly killing mobs in some form?
-do quest kill x mobs at y location
-guildleves kill mobs while running around like a retard
-grinding kill mobs in set location (in future when chains are added, i bet these complainers would quit complaining when they're faces melt off with high chain sp, but then again they prob won't make it into that party cause they're so against grinding mobs over and over again)

Seriously every mmo in the world has some mechanic that is boring and repetitive, if you don't like it make your own mmo.

I think it's more about making this mandatory grind in every RPG, which I do acknowledge exists, seemless to the point where players are having enough fun to not even notice they are grinding mountains of xp.

That's the topic being discussed: how can we make a better mode of leveling besides beating our brains out on common monsters in the world for hours with no content or substance surrounding it?

As someone else pointed out, grinding mobs allows for limited exploration as many zones go untouched because they are deemed "too difficult to camp in" so we need to find a way to immerse ourselves in this world of Eorzea without this limit.

I find it confusing how people say grinding has you exploring the world when you really set up a CAMP in one spot and stay there >.<. Doesn't sound like nearly as much exploring is going on as there could be.

[kukurumei]

I think it's more about making this mandatory grind in every RPG, which I do acknowledge exists, seemless to the point where players are having enough fun to not even notice they are grinding mountains of xp.

That's the topic being discussed: how can we make a better mode of leveling besides beating our brains out on common monsters in the world for hours with no content or substance surrounding it?

As someone else pointed out, grinding mobs allows for limited exploration as many zones go untouched because they are deemed "too difficult to camp in" so we need to find a way to immerse ourselves in this world of Eorzea without this limit.

I find it confusing how people say grinding has you exploring the world when you really set up a CAMP in one spot and stay there >.<. Doesn't sound like nearly as much exploring is going on as there could be.

Yes it's call paying more for more and better content. That's the model of F2P and DLCs. You can choose those type of business models...they'll be glad to hire a building full of writers and creators if you can sustain their profit margins.

MMO has to live within the rules of MMO.

[iAeris]

I actually believe the best to gain exp and become emersed in the story line/game should be via quest completion, not simply grinding, thus as your going through the motion of completing a quest your also gain exp from you actions. However the quests themself/ leves are quite boring at times.

Also I have found in this game players do not seem to communicate much at all unlike say lineage 2. Which doesn't really help much when looking to form parties to gain exp.