Tanking habits

[LudvicStone]

didnt know it was super hard to attack the same target as tank or just press T, 2 times

[SarcasmMisser]

Tanks are now in the habit of not marking. This is probably the most irritating thing as a DPS to encounter imo.

Attack whatever you want to attack, if they are not bad they will watch this and be able to hold all enmity. All tanks need is a little awareness.

[Canadane]

I've skimmed this topic a bit and I'll throw my thoughts as someone who mains a tank class.
I've since given up on marking mobs. The reasoning, when I sat back and throught about it, makes a lot of sense. I've got two main thoughts. One more directed at DPS reading this, and another, about myself, which can be taken in by other tanks, hopefully. Maybe.

Target #1 will almost always be the one I throw a tomahawk/shield at first. There's quite little reason to bother marking #1 at any time during most pulls. It's quite visually obvious as to which mob is engaged as their name colour will change (assuming you didn't modify your colours to all be the same), it'll be the first to get to me, and be the one with damage.
Targets 2-5 and beyond won't make much a difference. In almost all scenarios I will have established sufficient enmity on the entire pull by the time target 1 has died. Meaning the kill order is completely unimportant now. Unless you are actively trying to steal hate on a specific mob, I'm not going to lose it. And I'm rotating through mobs often enough to check on enmity levels that I usually don't let tryhards to take mobs regardless.

Which brings me to my next point. If you're targeting what I'm targeting and thinking I'm focusing on that without me marking it stating so, you'd be incorrect. While using a <tt> macro or manually doing it isn't bad in itself, you shouldn't be overly reliant on it thinking you'll always have the right one everyone else is killing. However, that is completely moot because you can all split up and kill different things for all that I care after the first one is dead. I'm just sort of putting the message out there since others were talking about it.

However I know that not all dps are the same, and not all players play the same. A lot of awareness is needed by me. Yes I main a tank. Yes I outgear most non-final coil content. But the majority of people won't.
I'm aware enough to know to change how I hold enmity depending on my dps. If I have a BLMx2 or maybe a Bard thrown in there, I'm going to expect AOEs and a lot of them. I'll pull more.
If I've got a couple of melee dps I know to take more care in holding mobs still for positionals, making my dodging less dramatic. I'll probably pull less at once as well.
If my healer isn't decked out and armed to the teeth I'm going to pull cautiously until I can better gauge their skill. But if they're as geared as I am if not better, then I'm going full ham on it. Because even if the dps can't take out huge mob pulls, I know that the healer will kill me living through it which results in no issues.

However, please note that not all tanks will be people who main that class. The joy of this game is that you can be anything and play as any role. So if someone is undergeared compared to the dps, going in slow and marking each pull isn't going to be a bad thing. It may be the only way to quickly coordinate pulls enough to have a smooth run. But don't expect tanks that are equally geared to yourself to bother with it.
You may see this post and be like "well yeah this makes sense" or you may not agree at all! Regardless, you should absolutely take into account your companions in your party before deciding on how to play. If it's going to take an extra 10 minutes of your life to get through a dungeon it's not a large time lost.

So really, what I'm saying is, if you don't like what your tank is doing, just say something. You might get a nasty reply back telling you not to tell a tank how to tank. That's something I do consider a valid response as that person is the tank right now and you're not. However if it's someone like myself, I'll most likely adhere to your desires for less/more and try to have a good time in the process. I'm probably never going to see you again, so I may as well make our time in duty finder together enjoyable. All you gotta do is speak up! :)

[Wizhard]

Attack whatever you want to attack, if they are not bad they will watch this and be able to hold all enmity. All tanks need is a little awareness.

This. These days i only mark targets when a certain mob or add needs to die fast(bees etc). Everything else i can hold threat on and even if dps takes the aggro i can take it back without any problem.

[Mercuito]

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I did reply to those who were like lolnoob learn to play but I choose you cos you had a glourious myriad of contradictions in your post. I will just say this. I have played tank and watched tanks play. the only thing complex about tanking multiple mobs is that you spam your one aoe aggro mob and pop defensive cooldowns. it's not rocket science.

Also you seem to just be beyond understanding even yourself. like I said in one swoop you say the devs are trying to stop you in another you say the devs wanted you to play the way you want. it's sad really. Also in multiple mobs in a row unless mobs are useless it usually means pull carefully. In any case I actually thought you had something crediable to say but it seems you like to grasp at straws so take care and please get off my thread

[Aegis]

On literally every job except MNK I prefer the tank to pull as large a group as the healer can sustain (they don't have to heal for long, usually).

On small pulls, a healer can more or less fall asleep, the tank is never in any real danger. Both the tank and healer are underperforming in relation to their potential.

On DD jobs, on any pull of more than 4 mobs, it is faster to AOE them down (I think the number is something like 5 for MNKs, correct me if I'm wrong).

Obviously this is only something you can do if everyone's i-level is up to it (about 10 over minimum required ilevel for access) and you don't have 2 MNKs in party. BRD, DRG, NIN, BLM, SMN (to an extent), WHM, WAR all perform better on mulyiple targets.

I find it both faster and more fun.

[Bixby]

On DD jobs, on any pull of more than 4 mobs, it is faster to AOE them down (I think the number is something like 5 for MNKs, correct me if I'm wrong).

Rockbreaker (at the end of a normal chain) is better with anything 3+. Spammed with PB, it's better with anything 2+ until PB runs out. It's also better than Snap Punch at 2+, so if you've got 2 adds, Demo 1, Demo 2, RB, repeat is the highest damage finisher rotation. AotD's potency is equivalent to the other openers at 3+, but you miss out on the auto-crit or the DK debuff, so between that and the TP cost, I usually save AotD for 4+ (if they're squishy enough to die relatively quickly) or 5+ (if they're not).

That's just the raw damage perspective, though. I prefer one huge pull even on MNK just because it means less to consider. With multiple pulls, I have to decide how long I'm going to AOE so I don't run dry too soon. One really fast pull, one medium pull, and one slow pull is lame. With one huge pull, I just AOE my fists off, and even when I run dry, it's still faster than it would have been otherwise (partly because, chances are, the other DPS has not run dry).

[Leigaon]

People most of the time pull large groups, usually the party can handle it but on some occasions they can't. Not every tank asks for large pulls, or adjusts to the party settings..a lot just pull everything and think it will go as fast as it did in their last party. This usually causes mass death. Some people say they always ask or always check, but that's not the majority unfortunately.

In all fairness it's not just tanks..for every bad tank habit I could think up a healer or dps one. What do you all think it is that's causing some of these issues in general? People taking FATES to 50 and not going through the dungeons to properly learn how to handle things as they go up? Or people who have been 50 way too long and expect perfection from everyone and not considering that others may just be a bit new or not have max gear to destroy everything?

To the OP's final line talking about the whole AoE / Rinse / Repeat..maybe a mid-point would be good. A mini-boss sort of that has a few adds on it. Sort of like in the new dungeons though there's not many. Snake ladies with their orbs and adds / the..golden..thing in Quarn that has the hands that pop? Maybe these are in right directions? Or if I'm missing the point I'm sorry.

[Bucy]

In all seriousness, I understand the frustrations completely for those who have to deal with this in roulette.

As a PLD main, I tend to gauge the party first (What jobs do we have, how much dps are they putting out, can our healer really keep me up?)
If I think that the party can do it then I do a mass pull, if I was wrong I apologize and start pulling in smaller groups.
Seems that many tanks besides myself don't do this anymore sadly.

Me too. If the party can handle it in my estimation, I'd rather just do a big pull in a dungeon I've done 100 times. The sooner I'm done with my dailies, the sooner I can farm coils for gear I want.

I've given up on marking targets as well. I only mark if people seem remedial. DPS need to know the fight like tanks do. I'm not paid enough to play to hold people's hands.

[Ehayte]

the only thing complex about tanking multiple mobs is that you spam your one aoe aggro mob and pop defensive cooldowns. it's not rocket science

My AE rot on WAR is:

Gather, Use Bloodbath while gathering > Internal Release > Overpower > Infuriate > Overpower > Berserk > Steel Cyclone > Vengence > Overpower > Wrath Building > SC

It only gets better if you can go in Unchained or Infuriated for an extra SC.

My AE rot on PLD WITHOUT a WHM:

Gather, Use Flight or Flight while gathering > Flash > Rampart > Flash > CoS > Flash > SW > Flash > Shield Bash mob 1 > Shield Bash mob 2 > Shield Bash mob 3 > Flash > Sentinel > Flash > Fast Blade > Riot Blade > Flash > Circle of Scorn > Shield Bash mob 4 > Shield Bash mob 5 > SW > Shield Bash mob 6 > Flash > Flash

If you are a shitty tank you just spam OP or Flash. If you aren't, you do little things that make mass pulls safer or faster.