Booing when Coil2 Nerf was announced

[saeedaisspecial]

Is that why every week I see bad pugs after bad pugs on it? I'm not taking any side on this discussion but lets not say is cakewalk because is not. Is not one or two that had problems with it, is the vast majority I've pugged with. It cannot be just my extremely bad luck.

Sure you get the occasional one shots but in general the fights are hard and I like it that they are like that. Now echo and gear may make them easier in the future but I don't see how they would help on t7 to be honest when people will just keep stoning each other. 20fi more hp doesn't really make any difference to those mechanisms.

Mechanically the fights are very simple, just because pugs are bad does not mean the content is hard.
There is never more than one or two mechanics taking place at once, and even then they're generally things like "move now" or "turn away from party members" or "run to this tower".
When broken down the mechanics in the fights are very simple, the fact people manage to screw these up is a failure on the players part, not the developers for making it too "hard"

[Edli]

Mechanically the fights are very simple, just because pugs are bad does not mean the content is hard.

Seriously do not over-exaggerate so much. Very simple, cakewalk, total joke, just 3 out of 6 comments I saw here. You cannot have a serious discussion when you people do this.

They have the right amount of difficulty for pugs. May be slightly easier for dedicated statics but that's why savage exists. Just don't say cakewalk, that's just ridiculous.

[saeedaisspecial]

Seriously do not over-exaggerate so much. Very simple, cakewalk, total joke, just 3 out of 6 comments I saw here. You cannot have a serious discussion when you people do this.

They have the right amount of difficulty for pugs. May be slightly easier for dedicated statics but that's why savage exists. Just don't say cakewalk, that's just ridiculous.

When you break down the mechanics though, they are that simple.
Let's take a look at Turn 7.
Cursed Voice? Just turn and point it away from your group, nothing difficult about that whatsoever. Yet I've been in groups where people can't for the life of them do something as simple as turn around.
Shriek? Move behind the Renaud.
Petrifaction? Turn around, so hard.
Renauds are the only difficult part of Turn 7 because of how dynamic they are, and even then that depends on your strategy.

[kyuven]

Let's take a look at Turn 7.

it's not any single mechanic that makes it hard. It's that you have to deal with all of these mechanics together while killing adds while DPSing the boss that makes it difficult. t7 alone has six different potential roles for 8 different players. It takes time to learn.
I'm with Edli, they do have relatively simple mechanics, but everything from t5 onward throws a whole bunch of them at once that, even if you know what to do, you still need to EXPERIENCE them to get them right. Add to that everyone seems to have their own tactics for them (t6 has about 4 viable tactics pre-leafstorm, with another 3-4 after leafstorm. t7 has about two) and thus you add more to the learning curve.

[SinisterIsBack]

it's not any single mechanic that makes it hard. It's that you have to deal with all of these mechanics together while killing adds while DPSing the boss that makes it difficult. t7 alone has six different potential roles for 8 different players. It takes time to learn.
I'm with Edli, they do have relatively simple mechanics, but everything from t5 onward throws a whole bunch of them at once that, even if you know what to do, you still need to EXPERIENCE them to get them right. Add to that everyone seems to have their own tactics for them (t6 has about 4 viable tactics pre-leafstorm, with another 3-4 after leafstorm. t7 has about two) and thus you add more to the learning curve.

wha? 6 roles where? You have tank and OT, Kiter -- THATS IT. Where you derive 6 from IDK

juggling 3 beanbags isn't hard either. Singing isn't hard. Try doing them together

We arent talking juggling and singing though... We are talking face away, face away from people, and huddle. There is nothing difficult bout it.

They are. Every hard fight when you break it down mechanic for mechanic is made of simple mechanics. What makes a hard fight hard is the amount of them, the frequency and the overlapping of them.

What overlap? you BARELY get a voice and shriek overlap.. THATS IT. nothing else overlaps

[kyuven]

wha? 6 roles where? You have tank and OT, Kiter -- THATS IT. Where you derive 6 from IDK

MT, OT, kiter, healer, Ranged DPS, melee DPS.
Melee DPS don't have to deal with fireballs but are closer to the boss.
Ranged DPS have to deal with fireballs.
MT and OT are obvious
Kiter kites renauds
Healers...heal.

[SinisterIsBack]

MT, OT, kiter, healer, Ranged DPS, melee DPS.
Melee DPS don't have to deal with fireballs but are closer to the boss.
Ranged DPS have to deal with fireballs.
MT and OT are obvious
Kiter kites renauds
Healers...heal.

Yep, when you go into a fight, people expect you to play your job.

You aren't making much sense.

[Raxion]

MT, OT, kiter, healer, Ranged DPS, melee DPS.
Melee DPS don't have to deal with fireballs but are closer to the boss.
Ranged DPS have to deal with fireballs.
MT and OT are obvious
Kiter kites renauds
Healers...heal.

Well I'm gonna have to stop you there. You can't count fireball as being something that the ranged DPS have to "deal with". They get hit with it regardless, they just have to be healed up. "Being closer to the boss" isn't exactly something melee DPS have to "deal with" either. It's literally the only way they can DPS. Being close to Melusine isn't even a disadvantage in that fight.

The kiter and the OT have the hardest jobs in T7, and those jobs aren't really all that hard.

[Edli]

What overlap? you BARELY get a voice and shriek overlap.. THATS IT. nothing else overlaps

Since we're talking about T7 I as an offtank a lot of times got voice the moment I pick first add. A lot of times I get it when picking third add. Kiter getting voice or shriek when trying to do his job on positioning ren. These are overlaps in T7 and T7 is not the only fight in the game.

[NyneAlexander]

We arent talking juggling and singing though... We are talking face away, face away from people, and huddle. There is nothing difficult bout it.

If you are melee, don't get cleaved. Sometimes the tank will have to move the boss around, including facing where you are now. Be aware.

If you are heals, you will also have voice. Its your responsibility to freeze the renauds. Sometimes, your kiter will have to pick up a renaud from across the room. Sometimes, your voice duration will be longer or shorter than the previous one. Its also your responsibility to heal fireball damage on a ranged (or both). Particularly your kiter. Be aware.

If you are kiter, you have to be aware of your healers voice. You also have to be aware of your incoming fireball. Don't let your fireball overlap with the other ranged fireball while you are kiting around. Don't face the renauds OR the party if you get a voice while kiting. Be aware.

If you are ranged, you have it relatively easy. However, don't let your fireballs overlap with the kiter. This might seem tricky because of the way the game updates client side positions. Be aware.

In addition to the forementioned nuances, please also remember not to push the phases early, as it will result in not having a properly timed voice to hold the renauds. They will then awaken and wipe the raid.

So yea, it gets a bit more complicated than "Face away, face away from people, and huddle."