Booing when Coil2 Nerf was announced

[Ghasto]

Before any elitists disagree with me, please tell us the last time you voluntarily helped another player to run coil content without any expectation of a reward. Exactly.

Almost every day, though I help FC members or friends of the FC far more often than randoms in PF.

[VahnValbosce]

Before any elitists disagree with me, please tell us the last time you voluntarily helped another player to run coil content without any expectation of a reward. Exactly.

Um, I joined a random Turn 5 Pug the other night because I was bored.

I've run Titan EX for fun and because it was in the duty finder and I wanted to practice my Monks DPS rotation.

I've run Moggle Mog EX for LS members.

I help people OUTSIDE OF MY FC

I help people inside my FC

Do not use the "elitist" excuse that just because we can beat Turn 9, doesn't mean we Never help people get clears of other things. Actually that excuse is not an excuse, its a direct insult to players with the intention of making them look like jerks because they are dedicated to clearing content.You're buying into the non-sense that in gaming there are only two types of people: Elitists and Baddies. I am not an elitist and I clear Coil Turn 9 as well as help other people, so don't try and push that BS on me.

[VicViperion]

"The problem isn't that the mechanics are difficult. The problem is that one bad player on your team can trigger a 1-shot mechanic to wipe the entire party. You can have 7 good players and they won't be able to progress because that one bad player"

"echo and mechanics changes do nothing to alleviate the articial difficulty created by 1-shot mechanics."

And thats why Coil REALLY needs a nerf. Not in numbers, but in mechanics. It's pure artificial difficulty at it's finest, and worse, people actually support that kind of garbage. You having bigger numbers on your screen isn't going to do a thing when someone puts a Conflag on the party in T5, gets half the team petrified in T7, gets people eaten on T6, etc. It's a TERRIBLE gameplay mechanic to tie the entirety of a raid to whoever is the worst player in any given group. Because you're not playing the game, you're fighting against other players stupidity and ineptitude.

[VahnValbosce]

You're fighting against other players stupidity and ineptitude.

This is non-sense.

Allow me to reword your paragraph: "Good players should be able to carry noobs"

You really think its fair for 7 other people to have the fight NERFED on them because 1 person can't pull their weight? What the heck??? Now you are totally giving in to that 1 person, because Nerfing the entire fight is hurting the 7 other people who CAN clear it!!!

[Riepah]

Now you are totally giving in to that 1 person, because Nerfing the entire fight is hurting the 7 other people who CAN clear it!!!

How exactly does it "hurt" you when content you've cleared in the past gets nerfed? Why do you care so much?

Sure, if we look at Amdapor Keep's Demon Door, removing the bees was quite unnecessary and makes the fight stupidly easy, I think they should've been kept in. But yeah.. big deal? How can a nerf of past content hurt anybody?
"Uh, what an unnecessary change for silly noobs." <- that is the reasonable extent of what your reaction should be to this. Claiming you're "hurt" is really overboard. If you hadn't beaten it before I could understand that you felt a challenge was taken away from you before you had the chance to overcome it by yourself, but if you already beat it before the nerf, it really doesn't affect you adversely, no matter how you look at it. Aside from the "I want to feel special" thing, that is.

[VahnValbosce]

How exactly does it "hurt" you when content you've cleared in the past gets nerfed? Why do you care so much?

...But yeah.. big deal?

It is a Big Deal actually.

It presents a negative idea to the development team, that somehow they are creating raid content in the first place that is somehow WAYYYYY too difficult for the FFXIV playerbase. So then when developing future content, they will ALWAYS ease up on mechanics. Pretty soon the "past content Nerf" will expand into "current content Nerf". Don't think this will happen? If this Nerf Trend continues, you can bet top dollar that it WILL HAPPEN.

People enjoy challenging content, that is the truth. Because 1 person can't overcome the challenge and they constantly wipe the raid, instead nerf the fight for 7 other party members??? No thanks. That is BACKWARDS progression at its finest.

Beat AV in XI yet?

Easy content from SE, right? Simple mechanics, right?

How many years did it take for a legit win?

THIS IS NOT FFXI,

It's 2015 ALMOST and an entirely different game. Impossible Mechanics are different than challenging mechanics. TURN 9 is Challenging, Turn 9 is NOT IMPOSSIBLE.

And on that note: I'm done with this Forum Topic, I figured out it's basically just a bunch of people asking for content to get nerfed because -> they are the 1 person that wipes the raid -> they are too busy to play this game -> they don't want to work on something and progress with other people -> they want to be able to carry people, or don't have the patience for them to learn.

So their solution is: Make the game suck by Nerfing Content! ... Yea, great logic.

[CramerGamer]

If you hadn't beaten it before I could understand that you felt a challenge was taken away from you before you had the chance to overcome it by yourself, but if you already beat it before the nerf, it really doesn't affect you adversely, no matter how you look at it. Aside from the "I want to feel special" thing, that is.

What's wrong with that?

Coil isn't needed for progression.
It's not tied to anything else, 100% optional content - Story Mode Coil is already in the works.
Gear alternatives are plentiful -right now- and equal to anything in Second Coil.
New tome gear will be -better- than anything in Second Coil.
The only reason someone who can't clear Coil would want to is because they want vanity gear, which if they haven't earned it then why do they deserve it?
So much of the content is already directed at the casual crowd, why not let elite players have their own corner to enjoy? Not everything has to be accessible to everyone.

[VicViperion]

Strawman argument

No, you're creating a better game for it. Why, exactly, is artificial difficulty a good thing? Why, exactly, is tying raid progress to the LEAST CAPABLE MEMBER, a good thing? Protip: It isn't. No legitimately challenging team game ties EVERYONES immeadiate pass or failure to one person. Which is exactly what the current raid mechanics do, and why they're the wrong direction for any game to take. People SHOULD be able to pick up the slack for weaker members. People SHOULD be able to carry. Winning or losing SHOULD be a team effort, whereas currently, now, the fate of the entire raid is ALWAYS on the weakest link. And that is bad game design, plain and simple, to attach the entire progress of 7 other people, to whoever is the worst player.

[Ghasto]

No, you're creating a better game for it. Why, exactly, is artificial difficulty a good thing? Why, exactly, is tying raid progress to the LEAST CAPABLE MEMBER, a good thing? Protip: It isn't. No legitimately challenging team game ties EVERYONES immeadiate pass or failure to one person. Which is exactly what the current raid mechanics do, and why they're the wrong direction for any game to take. People SHOULD be able to pick up the slack for weaker members. People SHOULD be able to carry. Winning or losing SHOULD be a team effort, whereas currently, now, the fate of the entire raid is ALWAYS on the weakest link. And that is bad game design, plain and simple.

If the failings of one person isn't pinned on that one person, it then gets passed onto the healers.
In short; baddies get gud

[NyarukoW]

....
Before any elitists disagree with me, please tell us the last time you voluntarily helped another player to run coil content without any expectation of a reward. Exactly.

That is so true.

I've just helped a friend's FC member clear T5 yesterday, but then again the elitists all hate me on this forum. And to top it all off, those same people want an "no newbies wanted" checkbox for the PF and DF so they can exclude the newer people.