Rogue/Ninja Starting Class?

[JakzChurchill]

snips.

Here's the point; to you what is 'just as simple as', is a metric fuck ton of hours to a casual player. The majority of which will come over for Ninja and see if they enjoy it during their 1 month period, the majority won't get a job to 50, blast through the story then get hold of ninja and level that to 50 to really get the most of the job in a month. I'm not saying it can't be done, just for the majority it won't.

With that in mind we are trying to theory craft what's best for the company, and inevitably FFXIV:ARR. The more money the game makes the more money that can be invested into the games future; this is logic. So we as the playerbase are trying to theorise the methods Yoshi-P and co can use to transplant Ninja into the main story without affecting the original story. And knowing that Ninja/Rogue are purely based around stealth this is an entirely viable thing to accomplish.

[ZReport]

Here's the point; to you what is 'just as simple as', is a metric fuck ton of hours to a casual player. The majority of which will come over for Ninja and see if they enjoy it during their 1 month period, the majority won't get a job to 50, blast through the story then get hold of ninja and level that to 50 to really get the most of the job in a month. I'm not saying it can't be done, just for the majority it won't.

With that in mind we are trying to theory craft what's best for the company, and inevitably FFXIV:ARR. The more money the game makes the more money that can be invested into the games future; this is logic. So we as the playerbase are trying to theorise the methods Yoshi-P and co can use to transplant Ninja into the main story without affecting the original story. And knowing that Ninja/Rogue are purely based around stealth this is an entirely viable thing to accomplish.

And your point? Just because Yoshi-P likes to make things more accessible for causal players does not mean he has to (or will) go back and change the storyline in place to conform to said mindset. People will pay so they can play Ninja, regardless of what's required. If they need to pay to have sufficient amount of time, they will pay. If level 50 and playing though the story is required, people will do it or not play the game at all. It's really that simple.

It doesn't really matter theorizing "what's best"; Yoshi and co. will do what they feel is best within the bounds of the game's story and lore as well as what's reasonable for players. This is very similar to his explanation on why Rogue is the archetypal Final Fantasy Thief, or why he made Bards Archers as well instead of just minstrels like previous Final Fantasy games. Leveling to 50 and playing up to 2.2 story arc is a very easy and casual based.

Finally, they've already set up the storyline for Rogue and Ninja already -- they've had this planned for well over a year now, perhaps longer (I can show you an interview where they thought about Ninja as a job as early as 2011). It's the entire reason behind how 2.2 set the tone and foreshadowed both the job and the class. Don't be surprised when the class and job plays out exactly as I posted above, because it will be due to those same storyline and lore reasons. Even in the very recent Letter LIVE that happened, Yoshi-P stated that Doman furniture would be introduced to Eorzea overtime, as the Domans had "just come over" and "there hasn't been much trading with the Far East just yet." Obviously Doman furniture has little to do with the Ninja job outside of it's origins, but it shows the type of introduction that Yoshi-P wants the job to have. It's not going to be something that everyone can experience right from the start of their ARR journey.

[HeroSamson]

whats gonna be funny nobody is gonna get a party, when I do rogue I am strictly doing fates.

cause I know everyone is gonna level ninja or rogue and dutying up will not be a option not gonna wait for hours for a pt.

[TheMunimai]

I agree it will be odd seeing ninjas starting from level 1 without any of the main story being completed but if SE want to do it they'll do it. We really won't know a thing unless its confirmed by a GM or YoshiP or until 2.4 is released.

Personally? I would like 2.2 main story to be a requirement as it wouldn't make much sense to me - but that's me and my opinion isn't law so ya know...

Guess its a waiting game.

[LineageRazor]

god, i wish it too... all this talk will not be there if they had droped the class... no one play them anyway... why not simply say that you upgrade your class with the cristal and that all.

I'm always curious as to why folks are so interested in dropping the class system. While I agree that it is true that classes are all but useless compared to jobs, the solution in my mind is not "drop classes" but rather "make classes useful".

The class system (especially the way that multiple jobs can split from one class) is one of the things that sets FFXIV apart from other MMOs. It should be nurtured and made a useful, functional part of the game, not ripped out by the roots.

[MageBlack]

Sounds like 2.4 will be a great opportunity to level up my tank or healer class!

[SDaemon]

snip

Ridiculous role play reasoning, that you are using to pick and choose accessibility. If people want rog and nin to be restricted to post 2.4 story, then those same people should be advocating that anything pre 2.4 should be off limits to rog and nin. Because lore demands it yes?

[MageBlack]

I'm always curious as to why folks are so interested in dropping the class system. While I agree that it is true that classes are all but useless compared to jobs, the solution in my mind is not "drop classes" but rather "make classes useful".

The class system (especially the way that multiple jobs can split from one class) is one of the things that sets FFXIV apart from other MMOs. It should be nurtured and made a useful, functional part of the game, not ripped out by the roots.

I think the problem with class/job system is the lack of diversification between the class and job. Just a few extra skills you barely use and shuffled stats. I think, if they change it, they will want to make the difference between them more distinct and give the class some utility after level 30. Because there is very little reason to use a class once you get the job. Also, the armory system is very restricting when it comes to creating new class/jobs, I think they wanted to open that up. I don't think we will see a complete overhaul of the class/job/armory system but I do think we will see more diversification.

One thing I did like and miss from 1.0 was the Character level that was separate from classes and jobs. It provided a unique baseline for your character that helped immerse your character better into the world. If you spent 50 levels as one class then changed to another you should still have some of that muscle you built up carry over to the new class. Aside from gear, you are literally dropped to a level one again.

[silentwindfr]

the trouble is the jobs are an advanced version of the class, and recently Yoshi-P seems to say that they don't plan to add secondary class, mostly because it will be a pain for some class like gladiator.
don't forget that he have said himself, that it don't want to add a second jobs to a class that will have the same role.
the class system is a limitation now, if they drop it and devellop class as a jobs directly we will see less trouble. the way to change this it's still leave the class that become the jobs at level 30.
but i don't see them do that and that another debat hehe

Ridiculous role play reasoning, that you are using to pick and choose accessibility. If people want rog and nin to be restricted to post 2.4 story, then those same people should be advocating that anything pre 2.4 should be off limits to rog and nin. Because lore demands it yes?

just a reminder, FF14 it's a lore driven mmorpg, if you don't care for the lore it's your right, but don't hope they will not do it. they really try to offer us a good story and it begin to become interesting.

another point, that a loooooot of you seems to miss, them goal as dev of a mmorpg, it's to make people spend time in the game... more time in the game means more cash for them, make a class available later make people stay longuer on the game.
just saying...

[hamsteak]

it should definitely be locked behind the story quests, it makes zero sense to be able to become a rogue/ninja before you even meet yugiri and the rest of the doman emigrants