Rogue/Ninja Starting Class?

[EdwinLi]

Anyone remember back when Yoshi-P talked about introducing Advance Class/Jobs as a future content during a interview back in 2.0 era and he used the example.....

Red Mage may require Black Mage and White Mage?

Guess I'm the only one that remembers.

Anyways we may obtain Advance class/jobs eventually but right now we have no confirmation on where ROgue/Ninja stands. Only speculations.

[Exstal]

whats gonna be funny nobody is gonna get a party, when I do rogue I am strictly doing fates.

cause I know everyone is gonna level ninja or rogue and dutying up will not be a option not gonna wait for hours for a pt.

That's my plan exactly. Dungeons are worthless without roulette bonus and getting in queue is going to be basically be impossible.

[SDaemon]

snip

And again you dodge. Are you advocating that rog and nin should barred from doing any content pre 2.4, that includes CT, ST and Coils 1 and 2? Because that is exactly the line of reasoning you are using.

[Prototype909]

I don't think that the lore/story should be compromised just to appeal to people who won't even be playing the game if they can't play one specific class from the get go. That's just me. Having some random Ninja character that totally breaks the lore (Or would have to be some massive retcon asspull) would totally destroy that entire arc of the story.

[silentwindfr]

And again you dodge. Are you advocating that rog and nin should barred from doing any content pre 2.4, that includes CT, ST and Coils 1 and 2? Because that is exactly the line of reasoning you are using.

if we follow you thought, it means we can only do BC/ST/CT/... any content only one time... you are simply trying to justify a paradox by saying this. you argument are empty and it's pointless to talk to you, since you don't even try to understand... you are simply using new player as escuse for justify the destruction of the story...for what? gain time? hell, we are playing a mmorpg, the most time consuming game type existing... stop please, because either you are a troll or... well, i will stay well mannered.

[LalaRu]

I think you guys missed the point on which it was told the Rogue guild existed in Limsa loooooong before Yugiri came.
It is a secret guild, 2.4 will simply make that guild able to recruit its members even from players and not only NPCs.
I guess Thancred will be the class instructor, and instead asking for other classes unlocked, the level 30 job requiring you make the main scenario until Yugiri joins the guild, to be your job instructor then. 100% lore-safe!

[SDaemon]

if we follow you thought, it means we can only do BC/ST/CT/... any content only one time... you are simply trying to justify a paradox by saying this. you argument are empty and it's pointless to talk to you, since you don't even try to understand... you are simply using new player as escuse for justify the destruction of the story...for what? gain time? hell, we are playing a mmorpg, the most time consuming game type existing... stop please, because either you are a troll or... well, i will stay well mannered.

I don't think you understand what a paradox is or the fact that this is YOUR reasoning here that you are continuing to dodge for your own justification. It is your argument that is empty my well mannered friend.

[JakzChurchill]

Every option people who advocate for ROG/NIN to be usable as a new class has been set out purposely to not be lore breaking. Actively proving this can be done without breaking the lore, helped a lot by the class itself being based on shadow and stealth work and always being a secret.

Remember the Rogue guild is set up, Thancred is a rogue you will learn that from the same guild that taught him, guess what this guild was around before the main story and was most probably active during the main story, this isn't changing any lore it's truth.

Finally if you care so much about it breaking the story, guess what it does jack shit to your story, yours has already been told. all it takes is a bit of fleshing out the Rogue and Ninja story and boom it fits perfectly for new characters who are the ones who will experience this new view on the events, your character won't cause that part of the story has already been told to you.

blocking content of this kind behind the majority of the story only matters to new players, and it's in the players and devs best interest that this content be open from the get go.

[silentwindfr]

how my argument is empty please?
i did explain why is not possible, but since it seems you need a second time let's do it from the start:

- First the rogue/ninja we will get are not the thief or the doma ninja, they are a new technique that Yugiri will teach to the adventurer (check the 2.2 story, where she said she will learn the thief way of fight and come back later for teach us) it will be something she will create, more adapted and evolved from the two style.
- before the 2.0, never ever ever any doman was seen in Eorzea, actually exept people of the empire, we had never any contact with the rest of the world. the first contact outside the empire, was the people coming for the horse years event.
- before the 2.2 story quest line, we had never any information about a thief, even thancred had trouble for leaving them and was avoiding to contact them. meaning they don't allows stranger to barge into them turf and ask them to teach them way. like any secret organization. even thancred over the whole 1.x-2.x story line have never said to be a thief, we did learn it from the 2.2. before this he was always introducing himself as a bard. (not very convincing after the fight near the lake in the 1.x story line)

anyway, all of this is almost nothing, the trouble here, it's more all of this reason make the new player starting as a rogue, a paradox, he do exist before even the style is create... or the master is here. because Yugiri is not here before the 2.1! while this time she is fighting in Doma, how she can be in two different place at the same time.

your reason is, it's unfair for the new player to have to wait for get the hand on the rogue... well i don't see it like this, i'm envious of the new player that will start with the 2.4, he didn't wait for a new class for 1 years, nor he must wait between the questline of the 2.0-2.1-2.2-2.3-2.4 like we had, he will have the whole story said in one go! from viewpoint he is lucky!

but i will be a bit more rude, all i see in your reason is "we don't care of the story" like i have said before, and Yoshi-P have said before me, this is a mmorpg driven by a deep and continous story, if you ignore this, is your right. however it's a huge miss from your part to simply toss aside the whole story and universe for allows new player to get acces to something they will have anyway.
the game start with the level 50, not with the level 1, you have all the stuff that get unlocked at this level, the progression of your character really start there. not at the level 1!

ps: i highly doubt that the rogue guild will be in limsa lominsa, since even for this city of pirate, they are... criminal. the guild (dojo) will probably be in revenant's toll. and since we can only start in the three city... one more reason (i admit it's only me saying it, but it look logical to see it like this, Revenant's toll did evolve the most in the whole 2.X quest line, get a the new class added to the city will be a normal next step. but we will see. )

Every option people who advocate for ROG/NIN to be usable as a new class has been set out purposely to not be lore breaking. Actively proving this can be done without breaking the lore, helped a lot by the class itself being based on shadow and stealth work and always being a secret.

Remember the Rogue guild is set up, Thancred is a rogue you will learn that from the same guild that taught him, guess what this guild was around before the main story and was most probably active during the main story, this isn't changing any lore it's truth.

Finally if you care so much about it breaking the story, guess what it does jack shit to your story, yours has already been told. all it takes is a bit of fleshing out the Rogue and Ninja story and boom it fits perfectly for new characters who are the ones who will experience this new view on the events, your character won't cause that part of the story has already been told to you.

blocking content of this kind behind the majority of the story only matters to new players, and it's in the players and devs best interest that this content be open from the get go.

like i have said it's not in them interest to open up the class for the new player, it will give them a reason to stay more on the game.
it's not even a good thing for the new player, since it will give them more reason to progress in the story to know that the class will be unlocked like this.

and like i have said over there, it's not the same skill than the thief guild of limsa that we will learn, but stuff from yugiri.

[whiskeybravo]

Not sure if this has been mentioned, but it could be possible for them to introduce rogue as a starting class, they would just tell the story of Yugri earlier instead of later. I'm thinking of it sort of like how Revenant's Toll has changed, and the people that got to see it early on when it was just a couple of straw huts have those memories that new players won't. I doesn't seem like it would be that hard to just change those cut scenes to Rogue, those who have already viewed it are unaffected (maybe you watch them again, or it's just a brief synopsis when joining the guild), and current players that haven't got that far would see them when joining the guild (same as new players). I dunno, just my thoughts.